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A twenty-year professor on starting college this fall: Don’t

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Re: A twenty-year professor on starting college this fall: Don’t

#121

Post by jseliger »

chadlavi wrote: post #50

This seems pretty out of touch. Encouraging people to go right into the jobs market as 18yos without degrees is encouraging them to trap themselves at the (already rapidly expanding) bottom of the economic ladder, unless they're from an already upper/upper-middle-class family. And the same goes double for encouraging degreeless 18yos to skip getting paid entirely and volunteer. That's rich kid stuff.

Most schools will allow you to defer for a year. Consider taking them up on it. And if they won’t let you, well, a school that admitted you once will probably admit you again (or a different one will

And:

There are other important, worthwhile things to do if you take a semester or even a full year off

And:

If you defer or postpone, what’s the worst that can happen

Re: A twenty-year professor on starting college this fall: Don’t

#122

Post by gumby »

frankbreetz wrote: post #18

As a millennial college graduate, my number one piece of advice to college bound high schoolers is do the first two years at community college. The debt is not worth the experience. Most people spend the first two years figuring stuff out, community college is a great place to do that. I didn't even know this was an option until after college and I feel failed by my high school college advisors. Unless you are very c…

I don’t think your point is germane to the article, but to support it nonetheless:

I love to hire folks, even new graduates, who did the CC-to-UC track, and am sorry than many are embarrassed about it. They tend to have better focus and be more fun to work with.

I have a couple of friends who teach at CC in the Bay Area, one of whom was previously an assistant prof at Stanford for a couple of years.* They both have told me that they like the CC Because the students want to be there, do their homework, and want to learn. I remember as a TA that many Stanford students didn’t seem all that dedicated to doing their homework unless it counted in the grade, though all of them were smart and interesting.

* I believe Stanford didn’t value his contributions and encouraged him to seek alternative employment. This was a long time ago.

Re: A twenty-year professor on starting college this fall: Don’t

#123

Post by gumby »

downerending wrote: post #11

Arguing in the other direction, if you mainly just need the sheepskin, this might be an unusually easy time to get one. Personally, my college experience was mainly useful for discovering that my college experience wasn't going to be very useful for me. (Mildly interesting: The author seems to be this woman. https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2020/02/17/la-verne-seek... )

> , if you mainly just need the sheepskin, this might be an unusually easy time to get one.

It’s a good point: this year and next will have an unusually high percentage of pass/fail options, but networking will be quite restricted.

Re: A twenty-year professor on starting college this fall: Don’t

#124

Post by glofish »

scott_s wrote: post #45
glofish wrote: post #6

perhaps a little bit premature advice college students are not at risk to begin with - I'd recommend waiting closer to mid summer it might be the best time to attend college, fewer people enrolled, getting more attention from educators etc

Everyone is at risk from Covid-19. Younger people are at less risk, but they are still at risk, both from suffering a severe case, and from death.

As of April 17, in the age group of 15-24, 13 deaths were attributable to COVID-19, 37 to influenza.

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/COVID19/

If you are a college student the risk of dying of alcohol poisoning is higher than of COVID-19.

Re: A twenty-year professor on starting college this fall: Don’t

#125

Post by harrydehal »

frankbreetz wrote: post #18

As a millennial college graduate, my number one piece of advice to college bound high schoolers is do the first two years at community college. The debt is not worth the experience. Most people spend the first two years figuring stuff out, community college is a great place to do that. I didn't even know this was an option until after college and I feel failed by my high school college advisors. Unless you are very c…

I cannot agree with you more. I'm also in that broad spectrum of "millennial college graduate" -- specifically, my college years were during the beginning of the last financial crisis (the 2008 "great recession").

I remember the stigma about going to community college (even in the Bay Area, California) when all my high school peers were going straight to Stanford, UC Berkeley, Brown, etc.

But I remember that the CC classes were tough, afforded me a ton of independence and personal responsibility, and to my surprise, found my professors were also concurrently teaching at Stanford or UC Berkeley.

The CC had guaranteed transfer agreements with certain University of California (UC) campuses, and also had a neat program called https://assist.org which allows students to be smart about mapping the relevant CC courses with the equivalent [transferable] courses at the 4-year institution of choice.

I saved a ton of money, worked my way through CC, took a gap year to work full-time to save up (and/or internships to build my resume), and was able to graduate UC in only 1.5 years afterwards (while also working on campus). E.g. 2 years CC + 1.5 years UC.

Sure, I missed out on some college experiences, but I matured quick, it allowed me to ride out the recession into a very strong position, and I cannot recommend it enough to young folks today. Especially today.

For those wondering, I graduated into a down market, but ended up in various tech and engineering positions, with no discernible difference between my peers who had gone straight to Stanford or Brown or wherever else -- and in most cases, I somehow [luckily?] ended up faring a lot better than most of them.

Lastly -- your resume will only reflect the diploma from the 4-year institution, not that anyone's asked, but you do not get put into a second-tier or second-class position because you started at a CC and transferred into a UC or 4-year, which I recall, was one of my early worries when I was starting.

I'd love to reverse the stigma about CC's, because I'm immensely proud whenever I see other CC success stories -- it is the path less taken, and in many cases a lot harder upfront because of that stigma and the amount of independence and personal responsibility involved -- but I think the dividends can be rewarding long-term.

Re: A twenty-year professor on starting college this fall: Don’t

#126

Post by [deleted] »

jseliger wrote: post #121
chadlavi wrote: post #50

This seems pretty out of touch. Encouraging people to go right into the jobs market as 18yos without degrees is encouraging them to trap themselves at the (already rapidly expanding) bottom of the economic ladder, unless they're from an already upper/upper-middle-class family. And the same goes double for encouraging degreeless 18yos to skip getting paid entirely and volunteer. That's rich kid stuff.

Most schools will allow you to defer for a year. Consider taking them up on it. And if they won’t let you, well, a school that admitted you once will probably admit you again (or a different one will And: There are other important, worthwhile things to do if you take a semester or even a full year off And: If you defer or postpone, what’s the worst that can happen

[deleted]

Re: A twenty-year professor on starting college this fall: Don’t

#127

Post by Chyzwar »

rlanday wrote: post #81
hanoz wrote: post #60

There must be a lot of people thinking they won't be getting the full experience if they start this year. I wonder if this will be the pin which pops the credit fueled runaway costs bubble? Anyone who ends up not bothering with it at all will at least have great reason for not having a degree - well I was all set to go to such and such, but then coronavirus, so I started work for a while instead, and just really got…

I don’t see how the college bubble continues as-is after this. What we had before was basically a common knowledge problem. Everyone knows college is a ripoff and, aside from a small number of degrees, the students are mostly just getting subsidized by taxpayers to drink and smoke pot for four years while the rest of us work and pay taxes. But, we didn’t all know that everyone knows that. There was also a coordinatio…

These kids that drink and smoke pot are paying in personal debt, the taxpayer is not really subsidizing this (at least based on what I was reading). For most career paths outside a small portion of the technology, college is the only way.

Part of the problem is that the US is not spending enough taxpayer money into education. If the US spends a portion of it military budget 570B$ to enhance education spending 70B$ problem could be massively reduced. To compare Germany military spending 50B€ and education 130B€.

Re: A twenty-year professor on starting college this fall: Don’t

#128

Post by soared »

Robotbeat wrote: post #19
kevindong wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's important to note that some colleges restrict the number of credits you can take/earn during the time between high school graduation and college matriculation. My alma mater, Purdue, permits incoming freshmen to take a gap year (but not purely due to Coronavirus [0]). During that year, the would-be freshmen may not take >=12 credit hours of courses or else their admission will be rescinded and the freshmen would…

Behavior like this and the for-credit/not-for-credit distinction (for the same class!) is some rent-seeking, power-imbalance nonsense. I hope we figure out a better way.

I would disagree. If you were accepted, but then had significant changes to your application you should reapply.

It makes sense that an acceptance is good for 3 months, and then you’ll need to reapply after that. If you went to a new school, the reapplication process is different.

Re: A twenty-year professor on starting college this fall: Don’t

#129

Post by harrydehal »

veeralpatel979 wrote: post #94
frankbreetz wrote: post #18

As a millennial college graduate, my number one piece of advice to college bound high schoolers is do the first two years at community college. The debt is not worth the experience. Most people spend the first two years figuring stuff out, community college is a great place to do that. I didn't even know this was an option until after college and I feel failed by my high school college advisors. Unless you are very c…

Pro tip: if you live in California, there's something called IGETC, which is a set of GE classes you can take at a community college. Look up the equivalent in your state. Once you do that, you don't have to take GE classes at most UCs and CSUs. Transfer students typically take IGETC classes at community college, which is what allows them to graduate in 2 years once they transfer. I realized I could take these classe…

I took a similar path to you. I did 2 years at CC and 1.5 years at UC.

And oh man, IGETC is bringing back some memories.

The resource I found useful for CC students in California was the https://assist.org tool to 1:1 map out your CC units against your CSU/UC credits so you are in and out of there efficiently (or better yet, are able to sign a guaranteed transfer agreement which can relieve some long-term stress about the admissions process).

Bonus points -- at least when I was at CC, I recall SATs were not required (although I had done them during high school), nor were the foreign language requirements quite as stringent!

Re: A twenty-year professor on starting college this fall: Don’t

#130

Post by soared »

collegeburner wrote: post #20

I'm looking at college this fall and seriously wondering about this. I'll have to spend a lot of money if I go to an "elite" school, and the point of doing that is to make connections with my peers and with professors. I don't see the point of paying that kind of money for that sort of experience. That aside, not starting college may not be a good idea, either. Does anyone with more experience have advice on this? I…

I graduated in 2016 and would recommend everyone possible go to college. Without a degree you are effectively in a lower tier on all job applications, promotion tracks, etc. A degree teaches you how to think, how to be responsible, and is kind of a mark of approval from society.

College is four years of fun anyway, not everything needs to be about progressing your career.

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