Linus Torvalds became US citizen • Hacker News Board

Re: Linus Torvalds became US citizen

#121

Post by eru » Tue, Sep 14, 2010, 4:14 PM UTC

logic wrote: post #82

portman wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a dual citizen of the UK and US. Among my close friends, I know Canadian, Israeli, and Australian dual-citizens. I've never heard of having to "renounce all other allegiances". (Note: it's entirely possible that there is some obscure method of obtaining US citizenship that requires it; but that's not the norm.)

I'm a dual Canadian/U.S. citizen, although I was born so in both countries (born to American parents on Canadian soil). I've never once had to worry about this whole renunciation thing. Additionally, my brother became a Canadian citizen (born U.S.), and again had no problems; Canada didn't care about his U.S. citizenship, and the U.S. doesn't care about his Canadian citizenship. He could officially renounce his U.S.…

There may be some upside to renounce a citizenship to do with avoiding extradition. But unless you plan to get involved in criminal investigations, it's probably not worth it.

If America would get a draft again, could a dual citizen be drafted?

Re: Linus Torvalds became US citizen

#122

Post by philwelch » Tue, Sep 14, 2010, 4:15 PM UTC

ugh wrote: post #95

philwelch wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US was a lot like that 200 years ago. Give the EU some time, they'll homogenize.

They had the last millennia to homogenize and it didn’t happen. The United States really are very much unlike Europe. That’s not to say it won’t happen but I don’t think it’s a foregone conclusion.

Yeah, but it's been what, 60 years since they stopped trying to invade each other? I don't think it's a foregone conclusion either, but I think it's definitely the trend the EU is on.

Re: Linus Torvalds became US citizen

#123

Post by gruseom » Tue, Sep 14, 2010, 4:17 PM UTC

lanstein wrote: post #115

jeffreyg wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

glad to see the reddit crowd made it over

"If your account is less than a year old, please don't submit comments saying that HN is turning into Reddit. (It's a common semi-noob illusion.)" http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Not an illusion in this case: that deep hierarchy of one-liners dominating the top of the thread is unmistakably Redditesque.

Re: Linus Torvalds became US citizen

#124

Post by _delirium » Tue, Sep 14, 2010, 4:18 PM UTC

jimbokun wrote: post #76

avar wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think not learning a second language has a lot to do with it. It's easy for most Europeans to pick up another language since they've already mastered a foreign language or two (including English). But it's much harder for someone from the US to move to central Europe, aside from the UK and some enclaves that speak English.

That is certainly part of it. But I also think some other countries do a worse job welcoming immigrants. Japan notoriously so. Is it easy to become a citizen of China or India if you want to "outsource yourself"? The EU gives essentially a free migration pass to all member countries, but how is it coming from outside of Europe? Any of you hackers care to comment on the situation in your nation of origin, or the one w…

I'm an American in the process of getting a Danish work permit, and it's easy so far, but they seem to have a special fast-track category for "researchers", and a Danish university is sponsoring me. I assume I couldn't just move there on my own. On the other hand, Linus also fits a fairly easy profile, so could probably get a work permit almost anywhere (highly educated and internationally famous engineer with steady employment).

Getting Danish citizenship, though, is notoriously difficult, and among other requirements, they require you to renounce any other citizenships (unlike the U.S., they actually enforce this requirement). Many foreigners, as a result, live in Malmö, Sweden and commute to Copenhagen (it's about a 30-minute train ride over the bridge/tunnel), since Sweden's citizenship laws are more lax, and once you have EU citizenship you're essentially good anywhere in the EU.

Re: Linus Torvalds became US citizen

#125

Post by xpaulbettsx » Tue, Sep 14, 2010, 4:20 PM UTC

trustfundbaby wrote: post #51

compay wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, the USA does not require that.

yes it does ... verbally ... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oath_of_Allegiance_%28United_St... But it doesn't mean that you actually renounce citizenship of your home country.

It does actually, but many countries such as Canada do not recognize it - they have their own process to renounce Canadian citizenship, and since you didn't follow it, you're still a citizen.

Re: Linus Torvalds became US citizen

#126

Post by _delirium » Tue, Sep 14, 2010, 4:22 PM UTC

kiuyhjk wrote: post #77

jbarham wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Incorrect. Green card holders (i.e., US permanent residents, but non-citizens) do not face "immediate deportation" if they change jobs.

No but it's still a hassle not being a citizen - especially if you travel a lot. By contrast Canadian permanent residents are treated exactly the same as citizens - except you can't vote in federal elections. Although with the choices on offer that's probably a blessing !

That's not the case with my family, at least. My mom was a green-card holder for almost 40 years until she finally got her citizenship a few years ago, and there was never any real hassle. She eventually got her citizenship mostly to simplify retirement planning (if she and my dad, who's a U.S.-born citizen, had different citizenships, apparently things get complicated with things like pensions and survivorship). I guess that's a kind of hassle, but a very cerebral one; she didn't get hassled at customs or anything, at least any more than I do. Probably being a middle-aged woman with an American family made her fit a low-risk profile anyway, but becoming a citizen has basically made no difference for her on that side of things.

Re: Linus Torvalds became US citizen

#127

Post by mkr-hn » Tue, Sep 14, 2010, 4:23 PM UTC

philwelch wrote: post #11

ceci wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dude, Linus Torvalds is not a low-wage foreign worker. He has done more to provide you with a job than you have done to get yourself a job. Opensource softwares have helped the US economy because lots of today's internet giants like Google benefitted from the use of opensource tools. They are paying taxes and employing Americans, ain't they. Linus Torvalds is synomymous with opensource. Mr America, if i might ask, wh…

Before you ask, you've been downvoted for failing to grasp irony.

Few crimes deserve a harsher sentence.

Re: Linus Torvalds became US citizen

#128

Post by duke_sam » Tue, Sep 14, 2010, 4:27 PM UTC

kiuyhjk wrote: post #117

ciupicri wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was under the impression that Ireland is/was the Celtic tiger (of Europe).

A lot of US companies put their HQ in Ireland because, they speak English (mostly), they have very low corporation tax and lots of golf courses - the Irish government also did an excellent job of marketing Irish-American links. Unfortunately as soon as the EU cracked down on the corporation tax scams, eastern europe became cheaper and US companies cut back on golfing holidays they realized they didn't actually have a…

Most of those companies have pretty large complexes in Ireland. Intel has 2 fabs, Google has a large (for Dublin) office complex as their HQ and MS has their own campus.

As far as tax havens go we actually had quite a lot of people from those companies employed, it wasn't just your standard shell company running out of a solicitors office.

Re: Linus Torvalds became US citizen

#129

Post by kiuyhjk » Tue, Sep 14, 2010, 4:29 PM UTC

davidw wrote: post #113

kiuyhjk wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Welcome to Europe. 500 years ago it was mostly principalities and city states, tried empires for a while, then we had countries for a few 100 years - now we are trying to abolish them again. It's very much a British (actually English) idea that countries are eternal and inviolate. IIRC Singapore and a bunch of other high tech SE Asian countries essentially did the same thing. Anybody with a high tech qualification, e…

> It's very much a British (actually English) idea that countries are eternal and inviolate. France is pretty nationalistic too, no? They're one of the harshest countries in Europe in terms of minority languages, if I recall correctly.

But only since about 1880. Before that 'France' was only about 20% of the country and only about 20% spoke French.

There was a huge effort to create a single nation, similar to the unification of Germany and Italy around the same time.

Their attitude to the language rather shows that - nobody in England thinks English needs 'protecting'.

Re: Linus Torvalds became US citizen

#130

Post by philwelch » Tue, Sep 14, 2010, 4:31 PM UTC

jeffreyg wrote: post #65

philwelch wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Before you ask, you've been downvoted for failing to grasp irony.

glad to see the reddit crowd made it over

Ugh. Yeah, that wasn't the set of comments I expected to generate either.

Sometimes I post a comment that I personally expect to be genuinely worth 27 points. That wasn't one of them. You have my sincere apologies.