Earlier quoted context omitted.
While I certainly don't buy the "pesky engineers" argument, it's actually somewhat plausible Porsche didn't know about the cheating (beyond what everyone knew, which was that the stated mileage and emissions were virtually impossible to achieve by any known mechanism). Since they dropped a VW manufactured engine (3.0 TDI) into a shared VW chassis (Touraeg) and built the Cayenne around that, there's a good chance the…
While I'm certainly not making excuses for VW cheating, I think that maybe the EPA needs to revisit its diesel emission standards. The EPA standard is the strictest in the world, and they have successfully ruined many diesel powered devices. Examples: 1) I was recently looking at compact tractors. To meet the standards, new tractors are fitted with Diesel Particulate Filters. Even if they don't flat-out fail (which h…
E.P.A. Finds More VW Cheating Software, Including in Porsches
121–130 of 160 posts
Re: E.P.A. Finds More VW Cheating Software, Including in Porsches
#122I'm conflicted. What do people think about the ethics of buying (non-diesel) Volkswagen cars at this point? Obviously new cars pad VW's profits and reward bad behavior. But what about used ones? Seems like prices will be plummeting. And if you like the cars, seems like a great time to buy.
Re: E.P.A. Finds More VW Cheating Software, Including in Porsches
#123Earlier quoted context omitted.
While I'm certainly not making excuses for VW cheating, I think that maybe the EPA needs to revisit its diesel emission standards. The EPA standard is the strictest in the world, and they have successfully ruined many diesel powered devices. Examples: 1) I was recently looking at compact tractors. To meet the standards, new tractors are fitted with Diesel Particulate Filters. Even if they don't flat-out fail (which h…
The EPA standard is the strictest in the world, and they have successfully ruined many diesel powered devices. One thought, then, is that diesels are not suited to the task. If that particular type of engine can't move things down the road without filling the air with pollution, perhaps it's time we moved on to something else. I mean, what tasks require a diesel? Commercial vehicles, okay. Consumer cars? Not if they…
As you have suggested, many manufacturers will probably move back to gasoline engines in some of the smaller applications ... but they will moved to air-cooled V-Twins for many of these, which fall into the same power range as the diesels they replace (~20-40HP). Air-cooled gasoline engines are not clean beasts, and this move will probably actually end up being a net environmental loss.
Have a look at the chart on page 2 of this: http://www.mtu-online.com/uploads/tx_templavoila/WhitePaper_...
The additional NOx reductions achieved by tier 4 are extremely small compared to the cost & trouble caused by the technologies used to achieve them ... the previous tech (up to Tier 3) was fairly reliable & had already achieved most of that was had in the overall journey from unregulated -> Tier 4.
Also, almost none of the garden tractors sold are diesel, because in that application it doesn't make sense - those engines aren't run at high load for long periods of time. However, for a compact tractor that may well be run all day long in high heat with a demanding attachment, a diesel actually does make a lot of sense - there is a large environmental cost to dumping a machine with 5-600 hours on it because the engine gave out prematurely (which happens to entirely too many of the garbage lawn & garden tractors sold at box stores, despite their relatively easy lives).
FWIW, I let my lawn die in the summer and probably mow it fewer times in an entire season than many folks do in a month ... living in the sticks with nobody to judge me has its benefits :) You did get reasonably close on the size, though. My dad and I live close enough together to share a tractor, and we have 26 acres, a goat, five horses, and sundry other critters between the two of us (and our wives, of course).
Re: E.P.A. Finds More VW Cheating Software, Including in Porsches
#124> new tests that were conducted on all diesel car models in the United States by E.P.A., the California Air Resources Board and the regulatory group Environment Canada. Environment Canada, a "regulatory group"? It's a department of the Government of Canada, yo.
Re: E.P.A. Finds More VW Cheating Software, Including in Porsches
#125I definitely think management was involved here. However, its entirely possible that some management was not aware of the details. I doubt that more than some couple tens of people at VW group know intimate details of the VW diesel ECU. With badge engineering/platform sharing, its possible that Porsche/Audi/VW or whoever was not directly responsible for delivering the code could be in the dark about it. Im sure they…
What does that have to do with anything? If Alice chooses to wrestle sharks in her spare time, that's completely irrelevant to Bob being forced to breathe toxic fumes.
Re: E.P.A. Finds More VW Cheating Software, Including in Porsches
#126Earlier quoted context omitted.
While I certainly don't buy the "pesky engineers" argument, it's actually somewhat plausible Porsche didn't know about the cheating (beyond what everyone knew, which was that the stated mileage and emissions were virtually impossible to achieve by any known mechanism). Since they dropped a VW manufactured engine (3.0 TDI) into a shared VW chassis (Touraeg) and built the Cayenne around that, there's a good chance the…
Surly Porsche has their own quality assurance and compliance engineers though? And they're proper Teutonic Engineers, right? I mean, they're Porsche engineers... They'd just take an engine from their parent company and not see that it lives up to the Porsche marquee? Maybe it's possible, but if it is, Porsche is really not the Porsche I think it is or want it to be.
Re: E.P.A. Finds More VW Cheating Software, Including in Porsches
#127Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm not an embedded developer, so I don't have much value to add re: architecture; however, this caught my eye: > The microprocessor has to run for 10+ years in a wide range of temperatures and be dirt cheap, so you end up with specs like 180 MHz, 4 MB of flash and 128 KB of RAM. If I'm paying tens of thousands of dollars for a car, how come they're using the cheapest possible components? If tinkerers can ship the Ra…
This is because the parts are orders of magnitude more expensive when being put in harsh environments These "really slow" parts are actually tested and built for much more extreme conditions. For microchips that go into satelites, you even have hand-checked chips that go through a very long (and costly compared to something like a Pi) testing process. Multiply this by all the eletrical components, and you got yoursel…
Re: E.P.A. Finds More VW Cheating Software, Including in Porsches
#128Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm not an embedded developer, so I don't have much value to add re: architecture; however, this caught my eye: > The microprocessor has to run for 10+ years in a wide range of temperatures and be dirt cheap, so you end up with specs like 180 MHz, 4 MB of flash and 128 KB of RAM. If I'm paying tens of thousands of dollars for a car, how come they're using the cheapest possible components? If tinkerers can ship the Ra…
If I'm paying tens of thousands of dollars for a car, how come they're using the cheapest possible components? Save a dollar on the part, and you make a million cars, how much does that add up to? Or conversely, why spend more than you have to if the quoted specs do the job? What the hell am I going to do with four cores if I follow the well-written description above? And I'd give your Raspberry Pi a lifespan of abou…
Potting electronics in epoxy isn't terrifically difficult, and would greatly increase the durability. I'm willing to bet that a potted Beaglebone Black (for its real-time subsystem) would do just fine in my engine bay for a very long time. The hard part would be getting a single large-pin-count plug coming out of it to handle all the inputs.
This point is actually kind of moot because for a long time the ECUs of cars were located in the passenger cabin with wires fed in through a grommet in the firewall.
I'd wager that the cost of replacing this system with some standard real-time platform is so monumental, it won't ever be done. Good luck getting the automotive equivalent of BSPs (board-support packages) running on any system other than this.
Where this gets interesting is when the people who actually know this system die start retiring/exiting the market. There will be a pretty strong incentive to 1) keep reusing the same system with no new development, 2) accept the lead time in training students/etc, or 3) start paying crazy salaries for people to go out of their way to learn it.
Re: E.P.A. Finds More VW Cheating Software, Including in Porsches
#129I'm conflicted. What do people think about the ethics of buying (non-diesel) Volkswagen cars at this point? Obviously new cars pad VW's profits and reward bad behavior. But what about used ones? Seems like prices will be plummeting. And if you like the cars, seems like a great time to buy.
Hey, if you want to buy a shit car, I don't think ethics really factor into it.
All kidding aside, despite being in absolutely no danger of ever buying another VW, I would think of it like I think of buying from (to pick a recent popular whipping boy) Amazon: does giving money to the company vote for the world you want to live in? I like workers to be treated fairly and with respect, so no more Amazon for me. I like clean air and products that win because they're great products that don't rely on cheating to make them great, so no more VWs for me.
As for used ones (assuming non-diesel), I'll use another metaphor. I'm a vegetarian. What if my veggie pizza shows up with pepperoni (and assume I otherwise like pepperoni)? I eat it. Cow's already dead, I didn't request that it be killed for my meal, and they're just going to throw it away if I send it back. Might as well eat it. Used VWs? Money's already in the pocket of a crooked company, might as well buy one if it suits your needs. Just take it somewhere other than the dealer when it needs work. :-)
Re: E.P.A. Finds More VW Cheating Software, Including in Porsches
#130I'm conflicted. What do people think about the ethics of buying (non-diesel) Volkswagen cars at this point? Obviously new cars pad VW's profits and reward bad behavior. But what about used ones? Seems like prices will be plummeting. And if you like the cars, seems like a great time to buy.
I have one of the cars that will be impacted by the recall. Performance and fuel economy are both top notch. The cabin fit and finish are on par with vehicles three times the price. I'll certainly be holding on to mine. If the used vehicle price plummets I'd definitely consider getting a 2nd one for my wife.
Considering it's doing the automotive equivalent of leaving a turd on the sidewalk everywhere it goes, I'd be really disappointed if its perf and mileage were merely average.