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Preventing Burnout: A Manager's Toolkit

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Re: Preventing Burnout: A Manager's Toolkit

#111

Post by d4mi3n »

jseban wrote: post #94
y-c-o-m-b wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So stop putting them under a lot of pressure. The second tip hints at this, but it only seems to be a reactionary measure. Maybe all this goalsetting, OKRs and such is exactly the problem with the industry, always having to feel pressured to an extreme by metrics and stats which effectively mean nothing, when most people just want to put in an honest day's work and progress. You nailed it. The entire article can be…

> Give me work to do and leave me alone to do it. That'll solve a lot of the burn-out. Yeah but this really translates to asking management to actually do their job, and letting you do yours. Any hint at this attitude will get you in a world of trouble.

This touches on a theme I see in a lot of US organizations I work at: Lack of accountability at the management and executive level.

If you're well established in your career as an engineer today, you have leverage. Many of us have the very privileged luxury of being able to refuse to work at a place with poor management, or under a bad manager.

We likewise have the ability to say "no" to things. I wouldn't recommend making it a habit, and I'd also suggest qualifying any "no" you give to your supervisors, but it's important to push back when it's reasonable to do so. e.g. "I won't be on call because it is not in my employment contract and wasn't a responsibility I agreed to."

Re: Preventing Burnout: A Manager's Toolkit

#112

Post by AtNightWeCode »

I have been on the edge to burnout. Reasons why.

Incompetent people always stress everybody up:

They put enormous pressure on single persons.

They steel a lot of time and energy.

They try to get other persons to do their work.

They always sidetrack everybody into quests that are not important.

They never solve anything. Every solution to a problem comes with new problems that are more difficult to handle.

They always blame other people for everything, especially people they can get rid of.

They think delivery is more relevant than things work in production.

Re: Preventing Burnout: A Manager's Toolkit

#113

Post by caffeine »

How about:

* Listening to each person’s specific concerns carefully and in detail, and then applying as much creativity and empathy as possible to help them come up with a resolution?

* Giving people increased responsibility and increased autonomy as a response to signs of burnout?

* Quickly transitioning coddlers (who stifle growth), complainers (who destroy motivation), victims (who destroy alignment), braggarts (who steal credit and poison achievement) out of teams?

* Managing the team competently so that forward progress is actually happening and the whole team can see it and sense it and take pride in it?

* Ensuring that the team’s mission, the company mission, and business value are all aligned, and making the team stakeholders to give them agency?

Personally, I find saying “the employees have burnout, they should work less and celebrate more” is pretty naive. It’s likely to make things worse.

Burnout isn’t overwork. It’s more like hopelessness. Effort is being made but the emotional reward for visible progress towards a valuable goal is not forthcoming. It can feel like overwork, but it’s more the work to reward ratio that’s a problem.

Re: Preventing Burnout: A Manager's Toolkit

#114

Post by sergiotapia »

Gitlab you are not a startup, don't make me laugh.

Here's a good tip for managers of engineers. Don't be GO all the time. Let your team work on non-roadmap items every sprint. Every last Friday or whatever.

Don't give your team huge high stakes tasks every time. Give them candy in between to relax a bit and recharge. This job will break your mind if you don't cool off.

Re: Preventing Burnout: A Manager's Toolkit

#115

Post by malfist »

kodah wrote: post #53
y-c-o-m-b wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So stop putting them under a lot of pressure. The second tip hints at this, but it only seems to be a reactionary measure. Maybe all this goalsetting, OKRs and such is exactly the problem with the industry, always having to feel pressured to an extreme by metrics and stats which effectively mean nothing, when most people just want to put in an honest day's work and progress. You nailed it. The entire article can be…

American Corporations drink their own kool-aid, which is probably why they can sit there and talk about what's wrong concisely without knowing what to do about it. The days of servant leadership, or leading from the front are gone in terms of management. Instead, they're a self-serving bunch. Engineers are effectively the lowest on the hierarchy and their happiness matters to no one in the chain because everyone is s…

You have a very negative opinion about management. Please remember that managers are people too and they're (likely) trying their best too. Just as they give you feedback, it is often helpful to give upward feedback too. Especially if it's in the form of "I need you to do X to help me"

Re: Preventing Burnout: A Manager's Toolkit

#116

Post by [deleted] »

BlargMcLarg wrote: post #7

All the "strategies" (really just tips) follow the same pattern of either tunneling on overwork as a cause, treating symptoms or pathos. >Sid and Michelle emphasized that the earlier a manager can identify burnout the better. Honestly, at the point of identification, you're likely too late. Especially for something as insidious as burnout, which can last for years and not show any symptoms before it is beyond the poi…

[deleted]

Re: Preventing Burnout: A Manager's Toolkit

#117

Post by SQueeeeeL »

malfist wrote: post #115
kodah wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

American Corporations drink their own kool-aid, which is probably why they can sit there and talk about what's wrong concisely without knowing what to do about it. The days of servant leadership, or leading from the front are gone in terms of management. Instead, they're a self-serving bunch. Engineers are effectively the lowest on the hierarchy and their happiness matters to no one in the chain because everyone is s…

You have a very negative opinion about management. Please remember that managers are people too and they're (likely) trying their best too. Just as they give you feedback, it is often helpful to give upward feedback too. Especially if it's in the form of "I need you to do X to help me"

Won't people please think of the poor managers making ten times our income, come on guys, just because I will literally fire you when some VP demands it, were all on the same side. Here, have a cookie and forget this whole thing.

Re: Preventing Burnout: A Manager's Toolkit

#118

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0 »

outworlder wrote: post #65
BlargMcLarg wrote: post #7

All the "strategies" (really just tips) follow the same pattern of either tunneling on overwork as a cause, treating symptoms or pathos. >Sid and Michelle emphasized that the earlier a manager can identify burnout the better. Honestly, at the point of identification, you're likely too late. Especially for something as insidious as burnout, which can last for years and not show any symptoms before it is beyond the poi…

> Maybe all this goalsetting, OKRs and such is exactly the problem with the industry, Yes, yes it is. That is also a symptom of a bigger problem: management doesn't really have to be useful for the company, they merely have to _appear_ to be. Exceptional management is nearly invisible, which is great for companies, bad for careers. The solution? Managers will make noise and a lot of it. Part of this requires crazy de…

The more I think about it, the more it aligns with my experiences so far.

What?! Are you insane? What are we going to tell blue ribbon initiative committee?

Yup.

Re: Preventing Burnout: A Manager's Toolkit

#119

Post by StevenWaterman »

throwawaymaths wrote: post #105
StevenWaterman wrote: post #37

I suffered from severe burnout around a year ago, and only now am I starting to feel back to normal. Nothing here would have helped me, and it's pretty clear to me why that is the case. (Paraphrased from literature that I read at the time) There's two kinds of burnout. One is caused by overwork, stress, long hours, not enough breaks, no holidays, not enough headcount, and so on. The kind of things this article talks…

These are not two different types of burnout... They are one and the same. Pressure and overwork do not per se cause burnout... What causes burnout is if the effort-reward cycle misses (either repeatedly for small efforts, or if you put in a lot of effort and have a categorical miss) Reward could be anything. The feeling of a job well done (easy to miss if the project is a failure, or if management pivots), it could…

That's a really interesting hypothesis, and it would make sense. Is it something that you've come up with, or is there some literature I can read about it?

Re: Preventing Burnout: A Manager's Toolkit

#120

Post by kodah »

malfist wrote: post #115
kodah wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

American Corporations drink their own kool-aid, which is probably why they can sit there and talk about what's wrong concisely without knowing what to do about it. The days of servant leadership, or leading from the front are gone in terms of management. Instead, they're a self-serving bunch. Engineers are effectively the lowest on the hierarchy and their happiness matters to no one in the chain because everyone is s…

You have a very negative opinion about management. Please remember that managers are people too and they're (likely) trying their best too. Just as they give you feedback, it is often helpful to give upward feedback too. Especially if it's in the form of "I need you to do X to help me"

Interesting you thought I haven't tried to have those conversations upward. The problem is there's zero incentive for managers to listen or change.

I do have a negative opinion about managers. Managers mandated themselves into making x times the amount of their top paid report, control decision making, and have hiring and firing powers all in one position. Managers being people doesn't make them immune from criticism, and if me describing the status quo upsets you, then maybe we should be having a bigger discussion about what being in a captured ideology looks like from the ground.

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