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Ask HN: Have you accepted the TOS that give FB access to your WhatsApp data?

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Re: Ask HN: Have you accepted the TOS that give FB access to your WhatsApp data?

#111

Post by dotancohen »

mr_mitm wrote: post #69
dotancohen wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So it's like saying "Everything that you say to XYZ business we can listen in on"? Would we accept that from our phone companies? Does the term "business" include governments as well?

Yes we would. Since regular phone calls aren't encrypted, not to speak of E2EE, phone companies can listen on all calls. Of course I suspect Meta actually will listen on business calls while traditional phone companies will most likely only do so after a court order, but we put the bar much higher with digital services compared to regular phone calls.

I don't mean "can" as in "technically possible, even if they have no reason to". I mean "can" as in "explicitly invited, with the intention to use the data gathered to try to influence my opinion or viewpoints [1] in the future".

[1] Advertising, and maybe political messages

Re: Ask HN: Have you accepted the TOS that give FB access to your WhatsApp data?

#112

Post by humpydumpy »

Of course I did not accept the TOS change. I never accepted any TOS from facebook, nor whatsapp. Centralized communication systems are obviously worse than decentralized ones for everybody except the few people profiting from it. So I never signed up to facebook or whatsapp or any other such "service".

Re: Ask HN: Have you accepted the TOS that give FB access to your WhatsApp data?

#114

Post by kspacewalk2 »

DitheringIdiot wrote: post #51

We have a moral obligation to stop using facebook products. Ask yourself where do you draw the line? If you don’t think facebook has crossed it, then you don’t know enough about facebook.

We have no such moral obligation. Facebook is no better and no worse than a multitude of other companies that trade in attention and data. They've suffered an onslaught of bad PR lately, largely due to their singular success rather then being singularly evil or (on balance) harmful to the world.

A lot of this moral panic about Facebook's effect on society is just a projection of our general angst the democratization of media. A lot of our type of people, squishy liberal nerd types, cheered it on when it was starting, supposing that it will be an improvement over the status quo of pre-2010. Information flow will finally be free, and Evil Gatekeepers won't control it, that sort of stuff. Now that we've been disabused of the notion that this is a good development, we get all uppity.

Turns out your friends and neighbours always liked fake news, and always will. And so do you. Oops.

Re: Ask HN: Have you accepted the TOS that give FB access to your WhatsApp data?

#117

Post by shawnz »

TrianguloY wrote: post #38
bko wrote: post #32

Can someone give me a simple non-cynical explanation on what the update in terms is about? From my understanding, it only pertains to communications with businesses and give them some Facbeook tools to manage their communications with customers.

Not sure outside Europe, but here last time I checked it basically said that whenever you talk with a business account you are basically talking with Facebook, otherwise nothing else changes. Still will be nice to have another opinion.

As I understand it merely allows businesses to use tools hosted by Facebook if they want.

Re: Ask HN: Have you accepted the TOS that give FB access to your WhatsApp data?

#118

Post by humpydumpy »

rg111 wrote: post #17
ItsBob wrote: post #12

Nope, I still click the "X" in the top corner every time I open it. However, I use WhatsApp sparingly - my mum and one friend, that's it. At some point I'll remove it completely.

Migrated completely from WhatsApp to Signal and Telegram. I still run WhatsApp for the people I absolutely have to. For that, I am using an old, and almost bust phone I have from 5 years ago. No spyware on my primary phone.

> No spyware on my primary phone.

May I ask how you achieved this? I would be interested in that setup, maybe I could then get over the hump and start using signal (though I don't like centralized communication platforms, nor do I like phone numbers as identifiers). Last time I checked, signal required android or ios, so only usable with built-in spyware.

Re: Ask HN: Have you accepted the TOS that give FB access to your WhatsApp data?

#119

Post by shawnz »

theden wrote: post #5

They should really have a "don't ask again" button. Is it really opt-in if they ask the user every time they open the app? It feels like it's opt-in by attrition.

It's not opt-in and they never claimed such a thing, it is a mandatory update to their terms of service for all users.

Re: Ask HN: Have you accepted the TOS that give FB access to your WhatsApp data?

#120

Post by menomatter »

glitchcrab wrote: post #86
InsomniacL wrote: post #85

Nobody is talking about how ridiculous it is that none of these messaging apps talk to the other. everyone i know uses whatsapp and nothing else, no real choice until the apps talk to each other.

Why would WhatsApp ever have this functionality? It would do serious damage to the walled garden which they've so successfully built.

Those apps are becoming like phone numbers. Can, say Verizon, no allow you to message a friend on at&t?
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