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The Cult of Kubernetes

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Re: The Cult of Kubernetes

#111

Post by dangerbird2 »

aloer wrote: post #95
pstadler wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I‘m running at three node Kubernetes cluster for less than $10 a month using this guide: https://github.com/hobby-kube/guide Disclaimer: I‘m the author.

Ignorant HA requirements, will this work fine with a single beefy node in home network or would I be better off running multiple vms on that single server which then run separate Kubernetes nodes?

You can get a single-node k8s cluster running super easily with [Minikube](https://github.com/kubernetes/minikube). The more recent Docker for windows/mac actually comes with a kubernetes distro that piggybacks off the docker vm.

Re: The Cult of Kubernetes

#112

Post by cutler »

I gave up at Dyson running Terraform running Kubernetes. He's right - dev tooling has become a cult. Give me PHP+LAMP on a VPS any day over this madness.

Re: The Cult of Kubernetes

#113

Post by thewarrior »

vonmoltke wrote: post #110
twic wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this really true? There are plenty of job openings for people who are good at maintaining Java Spring apps!

They also pay a fraction of what the jobs "hip" companies pay, and often come along with developers Being treated as second-class citizens.

Yes exactly my point. Go lookup salaries.

Re: The Cult of Kubernetes

#114

Post by cutler »

collyw wrote: post #99
usgroup wrote: post #12

I think devs often make bad decision makers because in some sense tech is often an addiction rather than a pragmatic choice. The cycle of picking a tech, jumping ship to it, religiously evangelising it, riding the wave and then jumping ship to the next related tech is typical in my opinion. I try hard to correct for this bias but sometimes struggle with exactly the same thing. There's just something about wanting to…

Part of the problem is the hiring process (plus attitudes seen on here). Your resume needs to have lots of fashionable buzzwords rather than pragmatic good enough / keep it simple choices. You must keep on learning (lots of things rather than mastering any one thing). I can write a really nice site in standard Django with some JQuery, and it will take me half the time that adding React to it will. But adding React wi…

Rails with turbolinks or Django/Laravel + pjax is good enough for most purposes. When Kubrrnetes first appeared it was laughable if you used it for anything less than provisioning a massive fleet of servers. Now it's something you sprinkle on your corn flakes.

Re: The Cult of Kubernetes

#116

Post by tempguy9999 »

usgroup wrote: post #12

I think devs often make bad decision makers because in some sense tech is often an addiction rather than a pragmatic choice. The cycle of picking a tech, jumping ship to it, religiously evangelising it, riding the wave and then jumping ship to the next related tech is typical in my opinion. I try hard to correct for this bias but sometimes struggle with exactly the same thing. There's just something about wanting to…

Not just devs, it's really a management problem all round.

Management (top bosses) often seem want the latest ie. Big Data . It doesn't mater it'll cost a fortune and you'll get better results on a single server.

And if the devs are out of control and pushing for %tech% and getting it, that's management at fault. To be a good manager you need to understand what your employees are doing. I've met too many that don't.

Re: The Cult of Kubernetes

#117

Post by zeveb »

nobleach wrote: post #103
dagw wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And I've worked at companies where the devs where expected to know their place and not question ops, because ops was seen as the serious adults in the room keeping things running and devs where seen as easily distracted children chasing after the shiniest thing that most recently caught their attention. Made perfect sense when I was on the ops side and was super annoying when I was on the dev side :) Imagine if peopl…

Having worked in both DevOps (or Ops as we called it in 2002), there really was a belief that the developers were stupid, and they'd burn the whole place down if we gave them any leeway. As a developer, I've seen DevOps as a frustrating gate at times. The only things I think can fix this divide are communication and built trust. (and probably less assumed malice)

> Having worked in both DevOps (or Ops as we called it in 2002), there really was a belief that the developers were stupid, and they'd burn the whole place down if we gave them any leeway.

I've been on both sides of this divide myself, but have spent the last fifteen years or so as a developer. In my experience, developers will burn the whole place down if we're given the chance.

We're focused on writing code, and it's boring to write the same code over and over: we want to write new code, in exciting ways, and we are surprised when it fails in exciting ways.

We're focused on delivering features; our incentives are all about getting it done, not about getting it done well (our industry doesn't even have a consistent view of what's good or bad: note that C/C++ are still used in 2019) or supportably. Some organisations really try had to properly incentivise developers, but I've not seen it really work yet. DevOps is an attempt to incentivise developers by getting us to buy into ops. I've read a lot of success stories, but not seen a lot of success with my own eyes.

I do my best to be diligent, I do my best to wear my Ops hat — yet I still fall down. I don't think that it's unavoidable, but so far I've not avoided it, and I've not seen others avoid it either.

Re: The Cult of Kubernetes

#118

Post by cutler »

vonmoltke wrote: post #110
twic wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this really true? There are plenty of job openings for people who are good at maintaining Java Spring apps!

They also pay a fraction of what the jobs "hip" companies pay, and often come along with developers Being treated as second-class citizens.

Not according to itjobswatch.co.uk where Java/Spring roles fetch top rates. Same with Indeed.co.uk so which job market are you referring to?

Re: The Cult of Kubernetes

#119

Post by dragonwriter »

xena wrote: post #61
thewarrior wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think jumping on new tech and marketing yourself is a good decision for a developer as its a good way to increase their compensation and market value. If you're a developer stuck maintaining a Java spring app at some unknown company the best way to make a shift is to pick up Go or something and move to a startup. Else your career will stagnate. The best way to get promoted at many companies is to write a framework.…

Stagnate by what standard though? There is a certain joy in just maintaining the status quo.

> Stagnate by what standard though?

Range of employment options. Possibly salary, though that's more variable. There are some jobs keeping the lights on with legacy tech long after it is done being the hot thing, but typically with any particular stack it's a shrinking numbwrt of jobs often with shrinking average real pay unless it hits a phase where the decline in people able to do it exceeds the decline in work.

If you are riding out the last few years of your tech-focussed career (whether that's before retirement or before moving out of hands-on tech into, e.g., management) that's maybe not so bad, but if you planning being in tech for a longer period it's potentially extremely career-limiting not to adapt to current market focus.

Re: The Cult of Kubernetes

#120

Post by cooljacob204 »

pstadler wrote: post #40
echelon wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the cheapest you can run a k8s cluster in the cloud? I've been looking to spin one up in AWS, but it looks remarkably expensive for running personal projects.

I‘m running at three node Kubernetes cluster for less than $10 a month using this guide: https://github.com/hobby-kube/guide Disclaimer: I‘m the author.

Damn, wish I found this before I spent days stumbling through my first Kubernetes set up.
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