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One Island Grows 80% of the World’s Vanilla

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Re: One Island Grows 80% of the World’s Vanilla

#111

Post by IncRnd »

thx11389793 wrote: post #59
matthewwiese wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A "vanilla startup" is perhaps one of the most interesting ideas I've read in HN comments these past few weeks. If I may ask, are you from Madagascar or an expat? This is all quite new information to me so I am fascinated to learn more. Are there any sources you would recommend?

OT, but why are immigrants called expats when they're from anglophone nations?

expat = expatriate (someone living outside their home country)

from the latin expatriare meaning to leave one's own country

Re: One Island Grows 80% of the World’s Vanilla

#112

Post by markbnj »

FreeFull wrote: post #25
markbnj wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, most natural flavorings have artificial substitutes, but there is a market for the natural products even if nobody could really distinguish them by taste alone.

This comment reads a bit like a non-sequitur, given Alex was talking about natural substitutes for vanilla, and not artificial ones.

Good point, hastily written and deserves the down votes :). I really meant to say that some people want natural vanilla, and will pay for it.

Re: One Island Grows 80% of the World’s Vanilla

#113

Post by davidp »

jwilliams wrote: post #64
thx11389793 wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OT, but why are immigrants called expats when they're from anglophone nations?

In my experience, people have come to use expat to describe someone who is temporarily or provisionally living elsewhere (e.g. Gone to London to work for a few years). Immigrant is often used for people who have moved with a permanent intention.

Agreed.

An expat is someone "on assignment", who has and expects strong ties with their home country. People who fit this description tend to frequently seek help from their own consulates, for example. It's particularly relevant for Americans because we tax ourselves even when overseas.

An emigrant (as seen from the source country) or immigrant (as seen from the destination country) is someone who has (usually permanently) moved and now expects primary services and sovereignty from their new home country.

I highly doubt that the distinction is strictly an anglophone concept, although perhaps it's related that they sound similar and have similar roots.

Re: One Island Grows 80% of the World’s Vanilla

#114

Post by GordonS »

sov wrote: post #51
rch wrote: post #6

Growing your own vanilla isn't difficult, but it requires more greenhouse space than you might imagine. The plant grows like a vine, and it'll need to reach about 20' with multiple points of ground contact before producing pods. (as explained to me by an orchid enthusiast)

AS someone with vanilla, I'm gonna disagree with you a bit here. Growing your own vanilla is very difficult ( assuming you're not in a place where it grows outside naturally). Not only do you need a significant amount of greenhouse space (you're right--20' minimum to flower, but the vines can grow up to 120'), you also need all the very specific orchid growing conditions--low water/nutrient, high drainage soil (or ba…

Wow, thanks for this detailed post - I had no idea the process was so involved and complicated!

Re: One Island Grows 80% of the World’s Vanilla

#115

Post by WiseWeasel »

Alex3917 wrote: post #86
WiseWeasel wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately, you can only harvest black locust (aka Acacia) flowers for about two weeks out of the year, and they don't keep at all. Also, they're always hopelessly infested with bugs, so you have to think of bug juice when you eat them. That said, the French have a great dessert recipe for battered/fried black locust flower beignets: 1) Snip the bunches of black locust flowers from the tree at their base stem. May…

> they don't keep at all Supposedly they freeze pretty well actually, never tried it though. (Or at least they maintain their flavor if not their texture, which is all that matters if you're taking them out of the recipe anyway after infusing.)

You might be able to do a preparation like orange flower water, a little bit of which is really good added to that pancake batter (and lots of baked goods - often in lieu of vanilla). I'd imagine black locust flower water might be used in a similar fashion. I'm guessing flower water is the aqueous fraction of a non-alcoholic distillation.

Also, black locust flower syrup is apparently a thing if you don't happen to have a still handy:

http://www.natureontheshelf.com/food-and-drinks/black-locust...

That seems like it would be pretty good.

Re: One Island Grows 80% of the World’s Vanilla

#116

Post by AKifer »

matthewwiese wrote: post #42
AKifer wrote: post #8

And it's even grown only in 2 very specific regions in the north of the island (where most of the cocoa production also come from). There's still huge opportunities if you have enough money and appetite for adventure to start a trading or setting up a plantation. 1ha yields on average 300-400 kg of dried vanilla, a process that takes on average 6-8 months from manual pollination to end of drying. Madagascar is quite…

A "vanilla startup" is perhaps one of the most interesting ideas I've read in HN comments these past few weeks. If I may ask, are you from Madagascar or an expat? This is all quite new information to me so I am fascinated to learn more. Are there any sources you would recommend?

@matthewwiese I'm native of Madagascar. In fact a lot of french "expats" and madagascan living abroad are setting up small trading/exportation operations for the french/european market, only a few hundreds kilograms per year is enough to sustain an equivalent of a US upper class revenue. Wikipedia offers a good overview of the thing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vanilla

Re: One Island Grows 80% of the World’s Vanilla

#117

Post by lordnacho »

> In 1841, one young innovator figured out an unlikely solution. Edmond Albius was a 12-year-old slave on the French-controlled island of Réunion, in the Indian Ocean. Using a stick and his thumb, Albius pushed together the male anthers and female stigma of the vanilla flower, pollinating it efficiently.

Did nobody think of this until years after vanilla was discovered? Really?

What's really interesting is how comparative advantage takes shape. There's several everyday products that originate in just one or a few places. Additional question: why isn't Mexico the main producer?

Re: One Island Grows 80% of the World’s Vanilla

#118

Post by AKifer »

sov wrote: post #51
rch wrote: post #6

Growing your own vanilla isn't difficult, but it requires more greenhouse space than you might imagine. The plant grows like a vine, and it'll need to reach about 20' with multiple points of ground contact before producing pods. (as explained to me by an orchid enthusiast)

AS someone with vanilla, I'm gonna disagree with you a bit here. Growing your own vanilla is very difficult ( assuming you're not in a place where it grows outside naturally). Not only do you need a significant amount of greenhouse space (you're right--20' minimum to flower, but the vines can grow up to 120'), you also need all the very specific orchid growing conditions--low water/nutrient, high drainage soil (or ba…

Great answer @sov, in fact if that was an easy process everyone would already have copied it [with a profit]. And it's not only about the process, the microclimates of the Sambirano valley and Sava regions of Madagascar give it a unique flavor. But that doesn't mean it can't absolutely be done anywhere else, that's only a matter of time.

Re: One Island Grows 80% of the World’s Vanilla

#119

Post by quadrangle »

0xcafecafe wrote: post #45
matthewwiese wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A "vanilla startup" is perhaps one of the most interesting ideas I've read in HN comments these past few weeks. If I may ask, are you from Madagascar or an expat? This is all quite new information to me so I am fascinated to learn more. Are there any sources you would recommend?

One a side note, I thought of a joke where his "vanilla startup" would be far from a "vanilla" startup. And that got me curious as to why the adjective vanilla refers to anything plain. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/vanilla "For lexicographers, vanilla has more flavor than chocolate, because it adds a tasty synonym for plain to the English menu. The noun vanilla was first served up in 1662, but it took a…

FWIW, I think it's fair to push back on bad use of language even as I'm not prescriptive in general. Using "vanilla" to mean "plain" is just wrong and bad. It's possible to make plain, unflavored ice-cream. Vanilla is obviously a real flavor.

Re: One Island Grows 80% of the World’s Vanilla

#120

Post by twic »

toomanybeersies wrote: post #50
ryanworl wrote: post #3

A slightly more up-beat version: A single county in Pennsylvania grows 50% of the mushrooms in the United States. https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/this-small-pennsylvania-...

Another interesting geographically focused product is rhubarb and the 9 square mile Rhubarb Triangle: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhubarb_Triangle At one point they grew 90% of the worlds forced rhubarb (a special kind of rhubarb grown indoors).

You and dreen should start a Rhubarb Fact Club: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17118067
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