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China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

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Re: China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

#111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And then there's Singapore. Ruled by an authoritarian, gum hating despot who provides nice civic infrastructure for the populace.

With a dictatorship it really depends on the competence of the leadership. This is not a robust strategy for organizing human civilizations.

Really? Because stable singular hierarchies is exactly how we evolved to have civilization.

Re: China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

#112

I hope that in my lifetime we see a revolution in China that overthrows the current authoritarian state and things like the great firewall and quasi-private/state run agencies go the way of the dodo bird. Unfortunately I don't see big American companies doing anything but continuing to court China and their growing class of wealthy consumers.

Are you saying that you want to see 100 million dead Chinese people? Because that is what you are implying. You will not have a revolution without spilling blood.

Don't know why you're downvoted, you're 100% correct. It's really easy to call for a revolution when it's not your country thrown in to turmoil.

Re: China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

#113
post #28

It's amazing to me how China is so effectively creating a 1984-type situation without much stir among the rest of the world. These chat programs are super important for everyday life in China. The same company that provides chatting also provides your ability to pay for everything, and a credit score that determines what you can buy, how much you pay, and more. So if you say something you shouldn't, this could very e…

> It's amazing to me how China is so effectively creating a 1984-type situation without much stir among the rest of the world. This is perhaps because of several things: 1) That's the way "the rest of the world's" governments and corporate interests want their own countries to go, and have been pushing towards since decades. The rest of the world's leaders (most of them) could not care less for the lip service they p…

[deleted]

Re: China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

#114
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Elaborate.

It'll take too much time to talk in details. Democracy in general in better than totalitarian in general, i don't disagree with that. However, establishing American democracy in China at this moment, most likely won't bring anything good or solve any problems China is facing now. And it's dangerous: If a presidential candidate say "Elect me and we'll take Taiwan back by force", the most likely outcome is that he'll g…

> And it's dangerous: If a presidential candidate say "Elect me and we'll take Taiwan back by force", the most likely outcome is that he'll get a shit ton of votes for that stance.

Sure, a revolution that ends in democracy would be extremely dangerous right now (the aftermath of Arab Spring comes to mind).

But if Xi's CCP keeps repeating that the Chinese should feel deeply humiliated by the West, and that conquering Taiwan (and the South China Sea, etc...) is the only way out, then the situation will become increasingly dangerous no matter the form of government.

It's fine if Chinese culture values stability, the problem is that ignoring politics leads to anything but.

Re: China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

#116
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At this rate, it seems reasonable to assume they'd use a kill vehicle to take the satellites out.

The Chinese government isn't stupid enough to commit an act of war and open up their own satellites to retaliation. They'll just ban possession of the ground terminals like they ban firearms, drugs, "subversive" literature, etc. It won't be completely effective but will prevent most people in China from having unfettered satellite Internet access.

> They'll just ban possession of the ground terminals like they ban firearms, drugs, "subversive" literature, etc.

They probably already have. I think their customs forms have a checkbox to declare radios and telecommunications equipment, sort of like the US has for agricultural products. My guess is you'll get extra scrutiny, at a minimum, if you check the box.

Re: China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

#117
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Elaborate.

It'll take too much time to talk in details. Democracy in general in better than totalitarian in general, i don't disagree with that. However, establishing American democracy in China at this moment, most likely won't bring anything good or solve any problems China is facing now. And it's dangerous: If a presidential candidate say "Elect me and we'll take Taiwan back by force", the most likely outcome is that he'll g…

It seems like your real issue isn't with "American democracy", but democracy in general. It doesn't appear you have much faith in the Chinese people exercising power directly or through elected representatives.

Re: China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

#118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Japan has nothing to worry about. The Treaty of Mutual Cooperation and Security Between the United States and Japan, signed after WWII, basically means that Japan AND THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA are responsible to ensure the national security of Japan (It's actually mutual with the understanding that the Japanese constitution forbids deploying armed forces abroad). In other words, if china is actually aggressive tow…

> The Treaty of Mutual Cooperation and Security Between the United States and Japan, signed after WWII, basically means that Japan AND THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA are responsible to ensure the national security of Japan China has long-range nukes. Behind every treat is political resolve. Would America risk lighting its cities on fire to defend a country across the ocean? (I hope so. But I'm not sure.)

> China has long-range nukes. Behind every [th]reat is political resolve. Would America risk lighting its cities on fire to defend a country across the ocean? (I hope so. But I'm not sure.)

The same could be said of China. Would it risk MAD by invading Japan? The US could be spurred to act due to the threat of eventual isolation and defeat after its allies are picked off. That fear is what fueled the regional wars like Vietnam fought during the Cold War.

In any case, it's estimated that Japan could develop its own indigenous nuclear capability very quickly if the need arose.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_nuclear_weapon_progra...

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2016/06/24/national/politi...

Re: China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

#119
post #28

It's amazing to me how China is so effectively creating a 1984-type situation without much stir among the rest of the world. These chat programs are super important for everyday life in China. The same company that provides chatting also provides your ability to pay for everything, and a credit score that determines what you can buy, how much you pay, and more. So if you say something you shouldn't, this could very e…

  If they choose, these ultimately government controlled companies can easily make it so you can't buy things anymore, you are not trusted anywhere
America already has that, it's called a credit score and it does this exact thing.

Re: China’s web censors go into overdrive as President Xi Jinping consolidates power

#120
post #18

I have one Chinese friend who employs a double entendre, calling him "Xitler" In all seriousness, this is a black period for Chinese people and China's neighbors. The fledgling democracy in Hong Kong, and democratic nations around China's periphery including Taiwan, Japan, Nepal, and India should be very wary dealing with a strongman who will stop at nothing to further his power and nationalism-focused legacy.

Japan has nothing to worry about. The Treaty of Mutual Cooperation and Security Between the United States and Japan, signed after WWII, basically means that Japan AND THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA are responsible to ensure the national security of Japan (It's actually mutual with the understanding that the Japanese constitution forbids deploying armed forces abroad). In other words, if china is actually aggressive tow…

If there's one thing we should have already learned from Trump, it's that treaties mean absolutely nothing if they don't meet US interests in realpolitik. All Trump has to do is start complaining about Japan "taking advantage of us" and before you know it, they'll be public enemy number one in his supporters' eyes.
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