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Tragically, as many as 9625 out of every 10k individuals may be neurotypical

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Re: Tragically, as many as 9625 out of every 10k individuals may be neurotypical

#101

Post by jongjong »

grebc wrote: post #56
jongjong wrote: post #40

So true. NT people are so frustrating! The scenario which drives me insane is; someone tells me some popular mainstream narrative about why we should do something in a particular way. Essentially just parroting expert consensus on a similar topic. I tell them exactly why this approach wouldn't work in that particular case and they concede to all my points. They fully agree and don't push back on anything. But then a…

David Chase(the wonderful creator of The Sopranos) has said on more than one occasion that people don’t say what they mean. I think in your scenario that’s applying both ways.

This has been a theme for me over the past couple of years. I'm noticing the limitations of words and language, including those that come out of my own mouth.

You can choose your words carefully, but it's useless unless your audience knows to look for those nuances.

Sometimes, in group meetings, I've caught myself repeating something twice in a slightly different way to increase the probability that people understood it correctly. But you can't repeat yourself all the time or else people will think something's wrong with you.

Re: Tragically, as many as 9625 out of every 10k individuals may be neurotypical

#103

Post by dofm »

danparsonson wrote: post #85
dofm wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> These traits have self selected for a reason, and any issues encountered are a fault of modern society not the individual imo. I mean, quite apart from the fact that you can be so profoundly autistic that you are vulnerable and cognitively limited, and so profoundly ADHD that you are incapable of keeping yourself safe. I am as yet formally undiagnosed ADHD; it is obvious, so obvious to me that either I am in later…

Sorry for your struggles. Not to speak to your specific experience but in evolutionary terms there are other ways to look at neurodivergence besides the challenges: https://complementarycognition.co.uk/ Hyperfocus for example can be highly beneficial if you manage to point it in the right direction, and in general neurodivergence tends to specialise either into explorers or exploiters, that is, those who are good at…

> Hyperfocus for example can be highly beneficial if you manage to point it in the right direction

If you have the social support to cope with the costs of hyperfocus: forgetting to complete other tasks, losing track of broader priorities, and the risk of burnout.

Hyperfocus is dysregulation. It just looks productive to everyone so we trick ourselves into thinking it is a benefit. But it is stealing from your present (other tasks you are neglecting) or your future (burnout).

People who can manage their time can generally get the same work done in actually a similar span of time without the downsides. Take a bit longer maybe but then won’t have days of being distracted or exhausted or ill. Viewed over any longer span of time it is clear that hyperfocus is not really a benefit to the brain with ADHD.

Re: Tragically, as many as 9625 out of every 10k individuals may be neurotypical

#104

Post by benj111 »

rglullis wrote: post #98
benj111 wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" the goal is to keep the ability to duplicate itself" You are talking about putting all your eggs in the tribal cohesion basket. That doesn't deal very well with black swan events. Not putting all your eggs in one basket maintains the ability of the tribe to "duplicate itself". So given that I have provided an mechanism for improved survival of the group, that doesn't require the group to be completely homogeneous,…

> You are talking about putting all your eggs in the tribal cohesion basket. Sorry, that's waaaay off the mark. I am taking about OP's remark where he wants experts to not "talk about his brain (development) having a genetic mistake", and I am saying that any individual with a brain that has developed in a way that diverges from the norm (and consequently makes it more difficult to socialize, empathize and find a mat…

So explain "If we are talking about genes, the goal is to keep the ability to duplicate itself"

That is your basis for 'mistake', and the general position that you are objectively right.

I am saying divergence from the norm can also be a benefit towards the goal of keeping the ability to duplicate. Therefore you can't say that the genetic imperative to duplicate proves you are objectively right. Therefore you can't really support the view that it is a "genetic mistake", unless you want to make the claim that everything thatmakes us different from our proto 1 celled ancestors is a "genetic mistake".

Re: Tragically, as many as 9625 out of every 10k individuals may be neurotypical

#105

Post by ThrowawayR2 »

cam_l wrote: post #8
roenxi wrote: post #4

I'm torn on whether I like this parody. It is quite funny and IMO in good taste (which is hard to do when diagnosing 9,625 out of every 10,000 as deficient). It probably works well as an in-joke for people who prefer critical thinking to social proof. But it isn't really appropriate to fight fire with fire when it comes to calling people disordered and the people who need to hear the message won't understand it becau…

>In fact, they may literally not understand the gentle ribbing and might respond poorly. That, IMHO, is what makes it so delicious.

"They called me mad, and I called them mad, and damn them, they outvoted me." - Nathaniel Lee, playwright, on being confined to a madhouse for 5 years.

Taking jabs at the majoritarian viewpoints enough to get noticed rarely ends well.

Re: Tragically, as many as 9625 out of every 10k individuals may be neurotypical

#106

Post by surgical_fire »

sethammons wrote: post #66
rppz wrote: post #50

[flagged]

You lost respect for a person and their writing because they like their brain and how it works? How so? Why? What drove this comment? Zero karma account; did you create it just to shit on this person?

Let me try to explain

"Neurotypical syndrome is a neurobiological disorder characterized by preoccupation with social concerns, delusions of superiority, and obsession with conformity.”

- Yeah, those people are super annoying!

“My brain is a jewel. I am in awe of the mind that I have.”

- Yeah, those people are super annoying!

Re: Tragically, as many as 9625 out of every 10k individuals may be neurotypical

#107

Post by rglullis »

benj111 wrote: post #104
rglullis wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You are talking about putting all your eggs in the tribal cohesion basket. Sorry, that's waaaay off the mark. I am taking about OP's remark where he wants experts to not "talk about his brain (development) having a genetic mistake", and I am saying that any individual with a brain that has developed in a way that diverges from the norm (and consequently makes it more difficult to socialize, empathize and find a mat…

So explain "If we are talking about genes, the goal is to keep the ability to duplicate itself" That is your basis for 'mistake', and the general position that you are objectively right. I am saying divergence from the norm can also be a benefit towards the goal of keeping the ability to duplicate. Therefore you can't say that the genetic imperative to duplicate proves you are objectively right. Therefore you can't r…

You are once again taking the worst possible interpretation: every mutation is a "mistake" in the process of cellular duplication, that's all I said. Whether this "mistake" will have good or bad consequences will depend on how this is manifested in the individual and how it will fit with the environment.

Re: Tragically, as many as 9625 out of every 10k individuals may be neurotypical

#108

Post by spider-mario »

znpy wrote: post #102

"tragically, 9625 out of 10'000 don't have issues" is it only me or this sounds crazy evil?

The point is to parody the pathologisation of cognitive functioning that differs from the societal norm (see: “neuronormativity”). You’re just reasserting that pathologisation.

Re: Tragically, as many as 9625 out of every 10k individuals may be neurotypical

#109

Post by [deleted] »

watwut wrote: post #27
roenxi wrote: post #4

I'm torn on whether I like this parody. It is quite funny and IMO in good taste (which is hard to do when diagnosing 9,625 out of every 10,000 as deficient). It probably works well as an in-joke for people who prefer critical thinking to social proof. But it isn't really appropriate to fight fire with fire when it comes to calling people disordered and the people who need to hear the message won't understand it becau…

> t probably works well as an in-joke for people who prefer critical thinking to social proof. Autistic and neuroatypical are not better critical thinkers. Fairly often they just ... dont understand certain things. And wont accept clear straightforward plain language explanation of what others want, because in their heads they should not.

[deleted]

Re: Tragically, as many as 9625 out of every 10k individuals may be neurotypical

#110

Post by spider-mario »

rppz wrote: post #93
Den_VR wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Lost all respect instantly. Just imagine there’s a cult that tells everyone that you and people like you are a mistake that should have been killed or “fixed” in the womb. I maintain respect for the author, they have a good attitude in a grim reality.

In my opinion, that’s just a victim mentality. There is a lot of suffering in this world. When you’re above average, like the author, you should be able to recognize that, put your own problems into perspective, and compare them to what’s happening around you. From there, the natural conclusion should be to stay quiet about it

It’s not the “natural conclusion” at all; it’s a fallacy of relative privation.
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