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US to rewrite its past national climate reports

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Re: US to rewrite its past national climate reports

#101
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, most people believe in climate change. In a fundamentally anti-human move, oligarchs have put a climate denier in office so he would push against doing anything about it, as it goes against their short-term interests.

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It was oligarchs that put Trump in the position to be elected in the first place. It was oligarchs that prevented him from being sentenced for his crimes. It was oligarchs that bought his election the second time around.

With a little help from foreign friends, of course.

Re: US to rewrite its past national climate reports

#102
post #44

Doctored Epstein vid. Inflation data full of estimates. Firing the guy that delivered bad job data. Shutting down monitoring satellites. Releasing modified constitutions. Now this …US really is going all in on detaching from reality

In the normal world, once you hitch yourself to a single implausible claim, you're bound by circumstance to try to keep it in line with reality, by making a series of supporting claims that inevitably build on weaker and weaker ground.

One of the problems honest people have understanding habitual liars is that they think liars are always incentivised to try to keep their lies plausible within a world of shared truth -- that they will always ultimately be caught out.

Hence the idea that the coverup is always worse than the crime. Everyone thinks the domino run of implausible claims ends with the liar being caught out when one lie does not move things on for the liar.

But in systems of power, in fact, there comes a point where it doesn't really matter whether something you're saying is true, it just matters that you say enough things that people get caught up trying to make them make sense and are distracted from what you are doing.

The dominos just keep falling forever.

This isn't new at all: one of the most influential men in Russian politics, Vladislav Surkov, absolutely learned to weaponise theatrical untruth in this way:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vladislav_Surkov

And there have long been fears that Surkov's techniques were infecting the West (through Hungary, Turkey etc.)

The problem is people simply don't want to believe, at any deep level, that these people lie for the sake of it, when in fact they clearly do. And they get caught up on the idea that since decent people think being caught lying is shameful, liars will always feel shame when caught out.

Once you understand that they do not, you can understand that any given lie may not be told to hide a specific misdeed; it may simply be told to add to the haze of untruth that allows the liar to go about their business.

Re: US to rewrite its past national climate reports

#103

I largely ignore this and just look around the world at the remarkable, sudden success of green energy and electric vehicles. We may solve the root of the problem while Republicans still call it a hoax. (It’s mostly a sad statement now about US ceding a huge growth area for its industrial base here.)

People will drive Chinese electric cars, while the US pulls up an Iron Curtain, people drive 30 year old diesel trucks and closes the universities down. What's next, a down to the countryside movement, everyone has to do five years of hard farm labor in Iowa?

Yes it’s horrible for US economic leadership and IMO is less about climate change and more about US willful ignorance sacrificing market leadership.

Re: US to rewrite its past national climate reports

#105
post #24

The study questioned whether heat records are truly increasing and whether extreme weather is worsening. I thought we were past that. I thought that it was now about questioning whether it was human caused, or the size of the impact. Apparently we really are going back, and revisiting basic arithmetic.

I believe in global warming, but the quasi religious responses here are hard to read.

Conserving the environment and taking steps to reduce our impact on the planet is a good thing. To that end, I’m ok with believing in global warming. I believe some of the narrative is used for selfish ends (green energy companies are looking to make a profit, too) and abused, but on the whole it’s a noble cause.

The replies here that are more or less “wow, can you believe these people don’t trust the word of the priests?” are extremely tiring. “Science” in this division is little different from belief. None of us (experts included) have the data nor intellect to holistically evaluate a system as complex as our planet. Our current understanding is likely wrong in some way.

There are plenty of good reasons to preserve the planet. We don’t have to resort to heretic burning and tribal shaming. It’s short sighted and intellectually lazy.

Re: US to rewrite its past national climate reports

#106

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." Feynman -- In this case, nature will not just not be fooled, it will extract retribution, unfortunately also on those that weren't fooled in the first place.

The old reports were somehow protecting us? Carbon emissions can only be reduced by engineering and manufacturing advances

Carbon emissions can also be reduced by our extinction.

Re: US to rewrite its past national climate reports

#109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nature has no feelings, there will be no retribution, things will work out just fine, it will just be tough for us, maybe even wiped out, but nature will prevail. life will find a way, look at places where humans get excluded, everything regenerates. It is not a crises of nature, it is a crises of habitat for us as species, and a bunch of other like us.

This is a pretty pointless nitpick. It's akin to saying that a large meteor strike is not the end of the world because the planet will still be here.

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