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US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

ukrainetoday.org

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Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#101

Post by koonsolo »

sras-me wrote: post #83
postingawayonhn wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

NATO has never been a threat to Russia. Under what scenario are all the governments of NATO countries convinced to attack Russia? Also Finland just joined and Russia barley registered a complaint.

>NATO has never been a threat to Russia This is a very naive take, I think. When you are responsible for the security of a nation, you can't just remain passive to the potential threats that shows up on your doorstep. I mean, it would be irresponsible his people if Putin did that and trusted NATO/US blindly to not cross the line, one way or another. (I mean, US could always make up some cooked up justification for th…

The Russian propaganda part is that you act as if Russia is defending, while actually they are invading.

Do the neighbors of France need an alliance against a French invasion? Do the neighbors of Germany need an alliance against a German invasion? Why not?

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#102

Post by jopsen »

dividedbyzero wrote: post #52

Today it's Ukraine and F35s, who and what will it be in a year? I suppose European governments are taking a long hard look at strategic dependencies on the US right now, like the whole economy running on top of Microsoft and Google and other US-made SaaS. If all of that went dark at once, I honestly don't know how some of the larger companies I know could keep operating. They all have fallbacks for critical infrastru…

In practice it goes both ways...

Lots of critical things for the US is made exclusively in Europe.

Lots of medicin that people rely on daily would be unavailable if EU/US trade broke down completely.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#103

Post by af78 »

sras-me wrote: post #78
af78 wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is russian propaganda and it is important to know what it says, to be able to recognize it when you see it elsewhere, from the mouth of an influencer, a politician, a comment on the Web etc.

Rejecting theories by labeling them "propaganda" with out any justification is not really helping here.

These bankrupt theories have been debunked long ago. The other comments in reply to yours did that well. The first video is literally Putin speaking, the second one is a list of Kremlin talking points, just with an Indian voice.

The term “NATO expansion” for example, is propaganda. Countries that had suffered under the Russian/Soviet oppression looked for protection when the USSR collapsed and requested to join the alliance.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#104

Post by lcnPylGDnU4H9OF »

fellow_eng_25 wrote: post #53
azalemeth wrote: post #38

Trump is really a disgusting human being. I'm not a US citizen but this looks an awful lot like treason -- he is actively helping an enemy of the state.

[flagged]

> war mongers

> endless

It’s a bit interesting to me that I’ve seen this point of view enough to know precisely the propaganda talking points made in Russian media.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#105

Post by rich_sasha »

bboygravity wrote: post #23
rich_sasha wrote: post #3

Right now every buyer of American kit is feverishly evaluating non-US alternatives. Seriously, America, this is like Brexit but 1000x. A voluntary decision, taken with gusto, to chop off arms and legs and ears and fingers and whatnot, cut off the deadwood, be light and free, a lone vessel on the ocean of prosperity, free of the burden of the stupid foreigners who are the sole reason why everything was going wrong.

Since when was the US in the European Union or even near Europe? How is it like Brexit in the slightest? Why is it the US's responsibility to finance and organize the majority of EU's defense? PS: I'm from and in Europe. I don't get why it is a good or logical thing that the US should be responsible for the majority of "Western" defense on our territory.

Brexit was about repealing long-term commitments for short-term gain, and a healthy does of FU to closest partners for domestic publicity. Oh and the short term gains never materialised, it was all costs in the end.

I see this as analogous. US is maybe reaping some short term benefits from flipping on its allies, but burning the bridges it very much relies on.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#106

Post by lcnPylGDnU4H9OF »

DFHippie wrote: post #77

People commenting here keep speaking as though Americans all decided to do this. Trump didn't even win the majority of votes of those who voted. And those who voted for him had only the most nebulous idea of what doing this would mean. It meant something like "Those people who never treated us with respect will get what's coming. If they don't love us they will fear us." This happens all the time. "Russia did X." "Th…

> "Russia did X." "The UK just did stupid thing Y." "Why are Germans suddenly authoritarian again?"

This is just the language that is used to refer to the governments as well as the people/culture. It may help to presume that, in most cases, they’re referring to just the governments.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#107

Post by eunos »

eitland wrote: post #99
eunos wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Better than having to cry in russian in 20 years. Also, according to Perun, if Europe collectively raises defense spending to somewhere near 4,5% (I think, check last Sundays episode) it will outspend not only US but US and China together.

Might as well adopt Songun.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#108

Post by kortilla »

ctack wrote: post #84
actionfromafar wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What would you do if you were a team of US oligarchs with connections to the administration and wanted to increase your share of, and power over, the domestic cake? Tell me it doesn't fit. Edit: this story just dropped off the main page. Currently sitting at 85 points and 77 comments. It had position 2 or so, now it has position 79.

Suspicious that it’s not on the front page.

There is absolutely no interesting discussion going on in the comments here.

Lots of political flaming and not much else.

Upvote to comment ratio is low and people are likely flagging it too because it’s just world news.

Re: US Ends Support For Ukrainian F-16s

#109

Post by jopsen »

realo wrote: post #71
jopsen wrote: post #65

I'm not sure Denmark is going to cancel our F35 orders. From a security perspective, it's certainly in our interest to pretend this isn't a big deal. And that everything is normal. But I'm not surprised that our prime minister recently did not leave out the possiblity of hosting nukes on Danish territory. Given the theatre in the US one could even say we'll need nukes to defend Greenland.

The Donald wants Groenland ... After that, why not Denmark itself ?

> After that, why not Denmark itself ?

Hmm, the US welcome to liberate us from sour tax burden. I suspect the invading force will surrender when they see the liabilities :)

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