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Fasting & Programming

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Re: Fasting & Programming

#101

Post by pessimizer »

_pius wrote: post #76
manmal wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are mistaken if you think that hunting was the primary source of food in times before agriculture. For many tribes it was (and still is, in some parts of the world) a secondary "luxury" which augmented the gathered food. As you say, hunting can easily fail, or game can become rare because of environmental hiccups. This happens more often than you should think - there are times when deer can't be found for weeks.…

Yes, one can use intermittent fasting to lose weight, but weight-loss usually only kicks in after 2-3 weeks. Citation needed. I personally know people who've lost weight long term with quite brief periods of intermittent fasting.

I think he's saying after 2-3 weeks of intermittent fasting, not fasting for 2-3 weeks at a time intermittently.

Anecdote alert, but I started doing alternate day fasting after I read the study, then 22 hour a day fasts after I read that people were having results with that. Went from 235 to 185 in 2 years (6' tall, fairly large build.) I'm not strict, and I go off it whenever I'm bored or severely tempted.

I count any drink other than water as a snack, and watch the bread, potatoes, and cornstuffs when I am eating. Who knew it could be this easy? I hadn't really been an overeater for years, I just had never had time to starve.

Re: Fasting & Programming

#102

Post by beagle3 »

graeme wrote: post #82
chc wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Times have changed. Nowadays we try to minimize our fat stores because overeating is a bigger threat to us than starvation is. If you're eating balanced meals intended to keep you slim, missing one is a bigger deal than if you pig out on a deer you killed and then miss breakfast the next day.

99% of the population has more fat store than in the days when people hunted deer. The problem is that people aren't used to accessing their fat stores for energy.

> The problem is that people aren't used to accessing their fat stores for energy.

It is my hypothesis that most modern fat stores are not actually energy stores, but rather "toxin" jails (I use "toxin" in the sense of: a substance that the body does not want, possibly because it is harmful, and that takes non-trivial time/effort to metabolize and/or get rid of; think of e.g. mercury).

Which would explain why they aren't being used: In many cases, the body doesn't have a chance to get rid of them because bad stuff keeps coming in.

(You may laugh, but it is not inherently less plausible -- or less supported -- than the idea that fat stores are used exclusively as energy stores).

Re: Fasting & Programming

#103

Post by beagle3 »

neutronicus wrote: post #56
sambeau wrote: post #33

As (a non-religious) someone who tried fasting while holding down a similar job, my advice is simple: don't break your fast every night. It only takes 24-48 hours for your body to adjust, your fat to start melting and your blood-sugar levels to stabilise. You also stop feeling hungry. I found that while I was generally a little 'light-headed' my powers of concentration were fine and I returned to full productivity. A…

My experience with this sort of thing is that despite thrice-weekly lifting sessions, I lose a LOT of muscle. Just a heads-up for anyone thinking of trying this.

> despite thrice-weekly lifting sessions, I lose a LOT of muscle

My experience is like the GPs (I only lose muscle if I don't exercise while fasting).

Do you have "nontrivial" muscles? My experience is that I don't lose muscles I use (If I don't jog, I _do_ lose leg muscles; if I'm not boxing or swimming, I _do_ lose arm muscles; but if I do both, and balanced exercises like crunches, squats, etc - I don't seem to lose anything).

Re: Fasting & Programming

#104

Post by beagle3 »

barking wrote: post #79
sambeau wrote: post #33

As (a non-religious) someone who tried fasting while holding down a similar job, my advice is simple: don't break your fast every night. It only takes 24-48 hours for your body to adjust, your fat to start melting and your blood-sugar levels to stabilise. You also stop feeling hungry. I found that while I was generally a little 'light-headed' my powers of concentration were fine and I returned to full productivity. A…

Another con is 'seriously bad breath' (acetone breath) which is clearly not good if your job involves dealing with people face to face

> Another con is 'seriously bad breath'

Goes away after a few days. And probably good for you - it means your body is finally getting rid of some stuff it should have gotten rid of before and didn't.

Re: Fasting & Programming

#105

Post by beagle3 »

primodemus wrote: post #74
jperras wrote: post #65

There is quite a lot of science and study behind fasting, and it can actually be good for your health. I say this as someone who does a caloric fast (read: no caloric intake at all, fluids allowed) 6-7 times a week for intervals of 16-20 hours, in addition to my 3x weekly heavy weightlifting programme and my full-time job as a programmer/devops. As of right now I'm the healthiest I've ever been in my life (physical s…

Could you detail your diet and exercise routine? I'm new to intermittent fasting and could use a little bit of advise.

biohacker Dave Asprey publishes had developed "The Bulletproof diet" around these principals (and a lot of others). He's selling stuff, but also gives a ton of advice for free. Google it if you are interested.

Re: Fasting & Programming

#106

Post by gwern »

dsr_ wrote: post #39
gwern wrote: post #15

> Let’s just say fasting isn’t one of them. All of my co-workers; I have worked with past and present have been extremely understanding and respectful of the [month-long] fast. Also as a by-product of this kindness they have coined the term: "Ramadan code". If I were an employer, after reading this...

If I were an employer, after reading this, I would encourage my observant Muslim employees to change their schedules and work at night, and from home if possible. Not every job can accomodate this, but many can.

Yes, that would be the legal lesson to learn from this. :)

Re: Fasting & Programming

#107

Post by beagle3 »

Jd wrote: post #28
nacker wrote: post #13

Fasting is good for your immune system as it stimulates phagocytosis. Here's a paper on Ramadan fasting: http://www.ayubmed.edu.pk/JAMC/PAST/21-4/Latifynia.pdf An amusing book on complete fasting by vintage american novelist Upton Sinclair here: http://archive.org/details/fastingcure00sinciala Personally, I fast regularly up to two weeks at a time, both for weight control and because I believe in it's overall long te…

Up to two weeks at a time of a total (water only) fast? I've done this before, but it was quite difficult to maintain in the midst of work pressures and I'm curious to know how you manage it.

(not parent poster here, but here's my advice):

Drink lots of water. When you feel like you _must_ eat right now (rarely happens after day two), drink a liter of water, and go for a short 5 minute walk.

Also, add a few drops of freshly squeezed lemon juice to your water. The availability of flavor is often enough to get you through the hard 5 minutes (and after day two, it is rarely more than 5 minutes).

Re: Fasting & Programming

#108

Post by GFKjunior »

makmanalp wrote: post #98
saraid216 wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What was the risk of getting mauled while doing this?

The majority of edible animals are not big game (by nature of the food pyramid), and a even a decent chunk of big game are not predators of humans. Plus, it's easy to overwhelm them if you have more than one person. I've never hunted before, but I can't imagine at all that it's a fair fight. Humans have been known to trap them, net them, flank them, shoot them at a distance, lure them, corner them, smoke them out etc…

Your post specifically said SPEAR hunting. You do not hunt small game with a spear. Trapping is usually the most effective way of getting meat in the wild.

Off topic but some of the best traps are large modern mouse-traps. Just make sure to drill a hole and tie it to a tree with a strong rope so the animal doesn't pull it away. Set it, and you will almost certainly capture a small mammal within a day.

Re: Fasting & Programming

#109

Post by leocassarani »

beagle3 wrote: post #104
barking wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another con is 'seriously bad breath' (acetone breath) which is clearly not good if your job involves dealing with people face to face

> Another con is 'seriously bad breath' Goes away after a few days. And probably good for you - it means your body is finally getting rid of some stuff it should have gotten rid of before and didn't.

> And probably good for you - it means your body is finally getting rid of some stuff it should have gotten rid of before and didn't.

That sounds like the sort of pseudo-scientific, unsubstantiated nonsense you hear all the time from New Age healer types. Do you have a source to back up your claim?

Re: Fasting & Programming

#110

Post by pronesmk »

quasistar wrote: post #6

While the author of the linked article expiates the hit coding performance can take when fasting I have personally observed an interesting phenomena during my observation of Ramadan. Namely, I can experience moments of acute lucidity and penetrating insight into a problem at hand. Usually this occurs when I am in the midst of something that requires a good bit of effort such as tackling a thorny algorithmic conundrum…

I also tend to notice an increase in my productivity and ability to focus during Ramadan. A good breakfast is essential, I usually stick to yogurt, granola and vegetable juice - say my prayers then head back to sleep for a couple hours. I can't say I'm not hungry when 820 rolls around but I don't find the month debilitating and most of the time my co-workers don't realize I'm fasting until it's almost over.
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