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Why Resumes Are Dead and How Indeed.com Keeps Killing the Job Market

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Re: Why Resumes Are Dead and How Indeed.com Keeps Killing the Job Market

#101

Post by _8j50 »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #88
_8j50 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh come on. OCR is a thing. I mean this is HN, are you normalizing acceptance of crappy software?

I would not blame the software. I'm pretty sure that images are not generally used as formats for resumes. I mean, at what point do you think it gets ridiculous? When it's a video instead of an image? When it's in Sanskrit? (Computer translation is a thing, after all.) When it's a video in Sanskrit? Or maybe is it more reasonable to say, look, this is some text, submit it in a standard text format? And an image is no…

I agree that what you said is more reasonable but most jobs are not for technical people. Even somewhat technical graphics designers might go over the top and craft a visually appealing resume and use a picture format.

Why blame anyone for this? Just use OCR where possible. If the application instructions specify a text resume sure. Having a picture resume in a .docx makes little sense but a PDF is both an image and text format. Not to mention a lot of people design their resume or have someone else make it and print it for them and scan it when applying for jobs as an image pdf.

Shit happens. Tech is supposed to make life easier not harder, despite of humans' failures not because humans arr cooperative enough right?

Re: Why Resumes Are Dead and How Indeed.com Keeps Killing the Job Market

#102

Post by lancebeet »

valdiorn wrote: post #45

How come I keep reading these types of posts, hearing these stories, yet I've never experienced anything remotely close to this? Job hunting has always been the opposite for me; being inundated by sharks trying to aggressively recruit me. --- For reference; here's a quick summary of my job history: Mid 20s, I was working for a retail bank in Iceland (where I'm from), doing ASP.NET and C#. With about 4 years of experi…

>How come I keep reading these types of posts, hearing these stories, yet I've never experienced anything remotely close to this?

Well, because you're a software engineer and he's a writer.

Re: Why Resumes Are Dead and How Indeed.com Keeps Killing the Job Market

#103

Post by pengaru »

expertentipp wrote: post #79
pengaru wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The quote is and always has been silly/wrong. Without a time machine you can't repeat the same thing. It's different every time.

Exactly Panta Rhei doesn't mean not to do the same thing repeatedly, it means even if one does it again, the water flows and the river is completely different.

The origins of the popular quote are apparently drug addiction treatment/recovery[0].

I doubt folks parroting it realize they're essentially regurgitating a line of Narcotics Anonymous propaganda associating addiction with insanity.

[0] https://professorbuzzkill.com/einstein-insanity-qnq/

Re: Why Resumes Are Dead and How Indeed.com Keeps Killing the Job Market

#104

Post by ofcourseyoudo »

hdjjhhvvhga wrote: post #12

> Now, it’s pretty early to be dropping an Einstein quote, but I’m doing it anyway: “The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.” While the quote is catchy and viral, and fits many situations, Einstein has never said that. Call me biased, but when you work in tech, you need to be precise.

Especially when you talk about how you are a professional writer.

More info here:

https://quoteinvestigator.com/2017/03/23/same/

Re: Why Resumes Are Dead and How Indeed.com Keeps Killing the Job Market

#105

Post by phatfish »

dboreham wrote: post #10

Never used indeed.com once. But...people should know that these sites, and recruiters, are basically hiring theater. Almost all jobs (perhaps excepting FAANG meat grinder) are filled through personal connections.

Nonsense, there is no way my company that is a simple mid size tech company could ever hope to fill most roles with personal connections. They try though, cash rewards for recommending someone that gets hired and passes probation.

Even with that incentive most hiring comes through a couple of in-house people that filter out the noise from the various recruiters they interact with.

Maybe with small shops < 50 poeple it might be possible.

Re: Why Resumes Are Dead and How Indeed.com Keeps Killing the Job Market

#106

Post by ianburrell »

gcanyon wrote: post #82
adeon wrote: post #35

The author says they've been applying to thousands of jobs. This is the resume the author is linking in the article: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/v2sv6ev393z9fkk62v1hw/Paul-Fu... I wonder, if this person's main method of applying has been online forms where you click the "upload resume", he puts this resume in and then everything fails from the start because the ATS is unable to read it. It looks like the text in t…

When I was applying, I had a situation where sometimes the ATS system would show me as Geoff and other times as Geo, with no clue why. Obviously, that's not a fatal issue, but it was indicative of other problems with my résumé, and I saw those in the auto-generated job histories. Pixelmator Pro just released a feature where it can open PDFs to show you the internal structure. I opened my résumé and sure enough "Geoff…

"ff" can be a ligature,ff. It is possible their system doesn't like the Unicode character. Even if isn't ligature character in PDF, the renderer could make it. Decomposition errors are common, as are not handling Unicode.

Re: Why Resumes Are Dead and How Indeed.com Keeps Killing the Job Market

#107

Post by ndriscoll »

yterdy wrote: post #25
dboreham wrote: post #10

Never used indeed.com once. But...people should know that these sites, and recruiters, are basically hiring theater. Almost all jobs (perhaps excepting FAANG meat grinder) are filled through personal connections.

This is true. Bottom-barrel* retail food service gigs don't count. (And even then... I'm certain the manager at the Gamestop I applied to at 18 binned my paper app immediately because he was hiring his friends.) People don't like to admit it, because it calls into question the meritocratic nature of our job market. American recruitment process are fair and appropriate, not corrupt, right? Well... *not in the skill or…

I don't see how personal recommendations are corrupt. If you have a known good employee, and they can attest to someone being a good fit based on previous direct experience with that person, that's a pretty strong signal. If the recommendation comes from someone not so great, or if it's more of a referral than a recommendation, you can weight it appropriately.

Re: Why Resumes Are Dead and How Indeed.com Keeps Killing the Job Market

#108

Post by expertentipp »

bsenftner wrote: post #73

I applied to indeed.com once, and it was the most demoralizing experience of my life. I'm a fairly accomplished sr. software developer; my last official title was "sr software scientist". I've worked on internationally famous software research projects, worked on the original tech for CD-ROMs at Philips, was on the OS teams of both the 3D0 and the original PlayStation (where I wrote the video subsystems), was lead or…

Sir, this is Accenture.

Re: Why Resumes Are Dead and How Indeed.com Keeps Killing the Job Market

#109

Post by colesantiago »

nradov wrote: post #76
colesantiago wrote: post #16

In the age of AI, GPTs, LLMs, etc, CVs are completely over as they are now to be assumed to be generated. Only real world projects (not toy demos), years of experience, and other particularly interesting (but relevant) hobbies would work although I'm not sure they count here. I've now seen companies raising their ask for Masters - PhDs for SWEs due to this demand. What works best unfortunately is being hired/acquired…

Why would any hiring manager care whether a CV is AI generated? As long as the CV is accurate, the tool used to write it is irrelevant.

> Why would any hiring manager care whether a CV is AI generated? As long as the CV is accurate, the tool used to write it is irrelevant.

How do you know if the CV is accurate or not?

Multiply these CVs by hundreds and you will introduce software to sift through fake AI generated CVs, or not bother deal with them at all as most hiring managers are extremely time constrained.

By now, I'm assuming that all hiring software have ATS systems by now that does this.

Re: Why Resumes Are Dead and How Indeed.com Keeps Killing the Job Market

#110

Post by satellite2 »

lopatin wrote: post #71
yowlingcat wrote: post #9

While my sympathy goes out to this person, I think this entire long, rambling, post could be condensed to a paragraph, or even a sentence: "It was a mistake for me to use Indeed.com." If you want the job (of finding leads, and finding jobs) done right, hire a professional -- a recruiter who will charge a fee and is aligned towards you finding a job. Trying to cold-apply to every single job with a spray and pray appro…

+1 for using a recruiter. I used to think that it was for scrubs. Then after trying one, so many interviews and doors opened, and then after I got a couple offers, they even negotiated a higher salary for me ( playing one offer against the other .. something that is necessary but I suck at)

Where do you even find a recruiter for hire? All those I contacted turned down offer to pay them stating they are paid by the recruiting company, which prevents our interest from being aligned.
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