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Buddha and Mind

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Re: Buddha and Mind

#101

Post by afarviral »

bgroat wrote: post #65
Barrin92 wrote: post #48

Think the article is right in its diagnosis of mindfulness. Jack Dorsey going on a meditation retreat so he can go back and be even more productive at building the things that send everyone to meditation retreats has always been kind of funny to me. The trend to turn spiritual practices into some sort of self-help healthcare to me is honestly just abysmal. In many ways it is worse than just not doing them at all. C.S…

That's not strictly true, RE: Lewis. His opinion was even cooler. Basically, Jesus was either: - A liar - A lunatic - The Lord And any three of those is incredible and worth learning about. He's either a crazy person who founded the most powerful organization in the history of human civilization. A con artist who did the same thing. Or literally god, and people are so cynical that ~75% don't believe it

Others have said it, but the 4th option; Jesus is fictional (not necessarily that he didnt exist, just the majority of writing about him is made up or embellished). Still somewhat interesting.

Re: Buddha and Mind

#102

Post by harleypig »

fishmaster wrote: post #99
_y5hn wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And, if birth is possible, why wouldn't rebirth be possible, or even the extreme default? It just seems silly to deny possibilities.

What is silly is saying that everything is possible until proven otherwise. It's possible when it's discovered, otherwise it's not.

If it's not possible, it's not studied or researched, so it will never be proven otherwise.

It's much more open-ended to say the opposite; that it's possible until it's proven not to be.

Much of our knowledge was discovered or formulated either because a person didn't know it "wasn't possible" or in defiance of consensus.

Re: Buddha and Mind

#103

Post by Borrible »

That is the beauty of capitalism, its ability to turn everything into a commodity to exploit it. Religion, science, lies, truth, everything. One has to love it.

Re: Buddha and Mind

#104

Post by gremloni »

_y5hn wrote: post #84
Trasmatta wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but overlook other passages about meditating over a corpse at a charnel ground As morbid as that is, I feel like I would actually gain a lot of value from doing that...

And, if birth is possible, why wouldn't rebirth be possible, or even the extreme default? It just seems silly to deny possibilities.

The burden of proof is on the person making the claim.

Re: Buddha and Mind

#105

Post by goodpoint »

Relevant: "McMindfulness: How Mindfulness Became the New Capitalist Spirituality" by Ronald Purser

''Provocatively illustrates how mindfulness has been hijacked by corporate interests, turned into an opiate of the masses, and how we can radically rethink the meaning of mindfulness in contemporary life.'' -- Dr. Steven Stanley, School of Social Sciences, Cardiff University

Re: Buddha and Mind

#106

Post by throwaway013222 »

emacsen wrote: post #16
lethologica wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you please elaborate more on the dangers of meditation?

This is a difficult topic because it's so fraught with misunderstanding and complexity, but I'd like to share a few thoughts, not all from the OP but from this topic in general. 1. Meditation as a tool for self-improvement Meditation, especially and specifically Buddhist meditation, has been sold to Westerners as a tool for self improvement for the purpose of "getting a leg up" and as another commenter pointed out, t…

These are not dangers of meditation in itself, but issues on how it is taught and understood.

Some forms of meditation can be inherently risky for people facing mental illness or emotional distress. That's why a good teacher is needed.

> idea that the practice teaches you to be able to handle enormous stress.

I never heard this in a Zen setting.

> Practioners are taught to stay in meditation through physical distress, through mental distress, even while being hit with sticks, etc. This is a form of training.

Phrased like this it sounds like Full Metal Jacket.

Zen, and meditation in general, can push people into confronting their emotions and inpulses and can be challenging, like psychotherapy. But it's not an ascetic practice and the endurance of suffering is not its goal.

Re: Buddha and Mind

#107

Post by throwaway013222 »

emacsen wrote: post #62
xelxebar wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> One of the paradoxes of Buddhism, but specifically Zen, is the idea that the practice teaches you to be able to handle enormous stress. Practioners [sic] are taught to stay in meditation through physical distress, through mental distress, even while being hit with sticks, etc. This is a form of training. Let me pick on this bit, because I have experience here. That sounds like a crappy, knockoff kind of zen. Any gr…

> That sounds like a crappy, knockoff kind of zen. If it is, it's a long standing one. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keisaku The stick is meant to "wake up" practioners but it's also used to help them learn to endure pain. But also, simply sitting in place for long periods can be painful- knee pain, lower back pain, etc. are common. Zen training is about letting of the need to react to it, accepting it and continuing…

Please provide sources around the idea of "enduring" pain. Zen, and Buddhism in general, focuses a lot around compassion.

People can encounter quite a bit of pain from sitting but the advice is to relax and "let go" of the suffering as much as possible rather than "soldier on".

Re: Buddha and Mind

#108

Post by goodpoint »

beebmam wrote: post #20
Falandafa2021 wrote: post #8

Meditation is about quieting ones mind to ultimate stillness. This is where the ego disolves which is not exactly in alignment with the culturally dominant materialism that we find surrounding us (i.e. the quest for money power and status) all things that rely on an inflated ego. Using meditation to improve in moving up in society is like using wood logs to put out a fire.

Stereotyping is extremely rude. How would you like it if someone stereotyped whatever regions that you are part of? You are certainly aware that even within your own set of cultures, there's a wide diversity of opinions on what people want in life. Let's stop making these kinds of silly generalizations. Within the United States there is a vast, vast diversity of opinion on basically any idea. I'm sure its similar vir…

Criticizing traits of a culture is different from stereotyping.

"culturally dominant materialism that we find surrounding us" is not implying that each and every person is materialistic.

The word "dominant" implies the presence of other, non-dominant cultures.

Re: Buddha and Mind

#109

Post by swayvil »

_y5hn wrote: post #90
swayvil wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know of only 2 meditation techniques. Samatha and Vipassana. (Aka Concentration and Growing. Aka meditation with a seed and meditation without a seed). I have never heard of a meditation technique that was not simply a variation on those 2. But if you have one then I am all ears. Also, ya, you could say that meditation touches some other stuff than just "getting intelligent with your awareness". Sure. And as far as…

Meditation doesn't really promote the intellect. It needs direction. Something which karma yoga may provide for societal concerns, hatha yoga for physical, jnana for mind, etc. There are over 100 meditations defined in Indian traditions. They're all useless without direction.

>Meditation doesn't really promote the intellect.

I can go with that.

>It needs direction

You mean like a goal?

>Something which karma yoga may provide for societal concerns

I think it's closer to aesthetics.

>There are over 100 meditations defined in Indian traditions. They're all useless without direction.

Meditation can be approached as an experiment and an exploration. No goal necessary.

And when investigating a true mystery I think that a goal is inappropriate.

Re: Buddha and Mind

#110

Post by Falandafa2021 »

goodpoint wrote: post #108
beebmam wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stereotyping is extremely rude. How would you like it if someone stereotyped whatever regions that you are part of? You are certainly aware that even within your own set of cultures, there's a wide diversity of opinions on what people want in life. Let's stop making these kinds of silly generalizations. Within the United States there is a vast, vast diversity of opinion on basically any idea. I'm sure its similar vir…

Criticizing traits of a culture is different from stereotyping. "culturally dominant materialism that we find surrounding us" is not implying that each and every person is materialistic. The word "dominant" implies the presence of other, non-dominant cultures.

I edited the comment I initially had it more aimed at westerners which I realized was a mistake.
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