Earlier quoted context omitted.
Germany is a great place to invest. So is most of Western Europe. The #1 thing you are looking for is _stability_ and a good engineering job market. Both is available. For this kind of automated high-tech manufacturing, nobody cares about salaries. They are <<1% of the cost.
Is Germany really stable considering Tesla story ? Chip making isn't clean by any standard.
TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant
101–110 of 450 posts
Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant
#102Earlier quoted context omitted.
The Tesla story had two sides - Tesla was aware about the high standards that would be applied to their factory, but somehow thought "we're Tesla so they'll create all kinds of exceptions for us if we pay the right politicians". Turns out not every country is as corrupt as Tesla's home country.
Maybe. But I think all the politicians Tesla could have bought are already owned by their German competitors.
Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant
#103Earlier quoted context omitted.
Germany is a great place to invest. So is most of Western Europe. The #1 thing you are looking for is _stability_ and a good engineering job market. Both is available. For this kind of automated high-tech manufacturing, nobody cares about salaries. They are <<1% of the cost.
Is Germany really stable considering Tesla story ? Chip making isn't clean by any standard.
And the Tesla story of ... Tesla getting quite generous permissions to rush-build a factory, Tesla rush-building the factory, sometimes going over what#s permitted and thus having some minor squabbles with the local authorities? That "story"?
Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant
#104I find it surprising that they are choosing Germany - after everybody is seeing what Germany is doing to Tesla's Gigafactory there (embroiling it in so much red tape that Elon wishes he could pull out if it weren't for sunk cost). It seems that Germany has a very good ability to convince and lobby these mega-manufacturers to base themselves there, but a very poor ability to actually let them succeed after making that…
Well, the UK just willingly put up giant trade barriers with their biggest trading partner. Doesn't really scream "free trade" to most people outside the UK. There is a reason why annual foreign direct investment into the UK almost halved (!) after the Brexit referendum. Probably one of the main reasons why TSMC doesn't consider the UK for this. Also skilled immmigration to Germany is MUCH easier compared to the UK,…
FDI in 2020 was almost identical to France (albeit yes 2nd to France in 1st place) for Europe: https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/jun/07/uk-second-t... This is counter to your claims concerning FDI.
I doubt it is "much easier" for skilled immigration - do you have anything to support that? How is it even measured?
Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant
#105Earlier quoted context omitted.
I would also like that, but its highly unlikely :) Saxony is actively pushing towards becoming "Silicon Saxony". Munich established itself as a design hub.
Munich does have Infineon as well and it's closer to lots of the eventual customers in the automobile industry.
And assuming that the automotive industry is the target customer: Volkswagen has their biggest plant in Saxony, which is their main EV plant. Also, Saxony is reasonably close to Brandenburg where Tesla is currently building their factory.
Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant
#106Earlier quoted context omitted.
I knew the Government mess up the solar market but I never knew just how much incompetence was at play there. Loosing industry to China (I am still furious about KUKA) is apparently a recreational sport for the CDU.
You got it wrong. The policies that heavily subsidized the solar industry were written by Merkel when she was the Minister for the Environmental Affairs in the 90s, but put in place by Minister Trittin from the Green Party after the '98 elections. The death of the German Solar industry was the result of KEEPING those subsidies TOO HIGH FOR TOO LONG. If the government makes sure that the demand is increasing at a very…
Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant
#107Earlier quoted context omitted.
What happened to the solar companies in Germany?
We spent a lot of money on solar, lots of German companies started to fill the demand, the Chinese came in and dumped prices, Germany decided not to import-tax -> lots of German tax payer money spent on installing solar power, but all the German solar companies were priced out of the market by Chinese companies. Basically, Germany built Chinas solar industry, let our own die.
Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant
#108Earlier quoted context omitted.
Keep in mind that for a high-profile engineer or lead who expects to make 400k at least per year, the company would actually have to pay him 800k to make that much net. Labor cost in Germany is sky high. That times a thousand is not insignificant.
According to [1] if you make 400k a year your employer has to pay 413k in total [1] https://www.brutto-netto-rechner.info/gehalt/gehaltsrechner-...
Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant
#109If i were TCMS, i would not invest in Germany. But as a german, living in Germany, i am happy that they consider an investment in Germany.
Countries that have semi factories in Europe: Germany, Italy, France, Ireland, Netherlands, UK, Austria, Belgium, and Hungary (with different capabilities and sizes) So it would be natural that it ends on the countries with existing factories and expertise. The German (or even we might say, "north-european") self-deprecation gets old sometimes...
Re: TSMC eyes Germany as possible location for first Europe chip plant
#110Earlier quoted context omitted.
Is Germany really stable considering Tesla story ? Chip making isn't clean by any standard.
The Tesla story had two sides - Tesla was aware about the high standards that would be applied to their factory, but somehow thought "we're Tesla so they'll create all kinds of exceptions for us if we pay the right politicians". Turns out not every country is as corrupt as Tesla's home country.