Google parts with Cloud VP over his manifesto renouncing his antisemitism • Hacker News Board

Re: Google parts with Cloud VP over his manifesto renouncing his antisemitism

#101

Post by lma21 » Sat, Jul 17, 2021, 8:22 AM UTC

esens wrote: post #33

This is a fact of life for Israelis and surrounding Arab countries. I am unsure why we pretend that these negative sentiments about each other do not exist -- they are incredibly widespread in these populations. Unfortunately in the countries around Israel with whom they have had wars, there is significant anti-Semitism: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3136059.stm And in Israel there is significant anti-Arab s…

isn't anti-semitic and anti-arab the same term? historically/technically speaking

Re: Google parts with Cloud VP over his manifesto renouncing his antisemitism

#102

Post by adsche » Sat, Jul 17, 2021, 10:21 AM UTC

lma21 wrote: post #101

esens wrote: post #33

This is a fact of life for Israelis and surrounding Arab countries. I am unsure why we pretend that these negative sentiments about each other do not exist -- they are incredibly widespread in these populations. Unfortunately in the countries around Israel with whom they have had wars, there is significant anti-Semitism: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3136059.stm And in Israel there is significant anti-Arab s…

isn't anti-semitic and anti-arab the same term? historically/technically speaking

No, and it never was. The term 'anti-semitic' always meant prejudiced against jews. This is not changed by the different meaning of 'semitic' in e.g. 'semitic languages'.

Re: Google parts with Cloud VP over his manifesto renouncing his antisemitism

#103

Post by cannabis_sam » Sat, Jul 17, 2021, 12:04 PM UTC

mhuffman wrote: post #88

UncleMeat wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except being racist is bad and being gay isn't.

This is just our current social construction. There was a time right-here in the US when those were reversed. And there are societies right now where those are reversed.

There was a time in the west when having a vagina made you property, it does not stop any of us from judging those societies or criticizing current societies.

Re: Google parts with Cloud VP over his manifesto renouncing his antisemitism

#104

Post by thirdreich » Sun, Jul 18, 2021, 3:51 AM UTC

ramesh31 wrote: post #74

Antisemitism is a lot like pedophilia; if you find yourself even mentioning its' existence, you're immediately suspect yourself. Best to never let the words even come out of your mouth regardless of context. Deny, suppress, gaslight, and ignore anything that even remotely touches the subject. No one ever got brownie points for profoundly exclaiming their lack of hatred for jewish people. (And you see I'll be downvote…

[flagged]

Re: Google parts with Cloud VP over his manifesto renouncing his antisemitism

#105

Post by thirdreich » Sun, Jul 18, 2021, 4:00 AM UTC

mattzito wrote: post #56

mfer wrote: post #13

If we look at things in terms of positive and negative reinforcement this has some interesting consequences. So, he admitted to antisemitism in the past and shared how he has grown or is growing past it. This kind of admission by him has the ability to challenge other and positively reinforce others who are in a similar situation to him. That _positive_ reinforcement for change away from antisemitism. He was pushed o…

So, I'll start off by saying - I work at google, in cloud, but not for this person, I don't know anything about him, and this is my own opinion. I think if someone had asked him at an all hands for his position on the israel palestine conflict, and he said something like: "I grew up in a strict Egyptian Muslim household, indoctrinated to hate Israel and Jews, and it wasn't until I was exposed to jewish people and bec…

Matt's view is spot on. While his intentions may have been positive, this was cringe-inducing read all the way. Don't understand why people feel the need to publish their dumbest thoughts publicly on social media to get lynched in the court of public opinion. Writing an opinion piece on topics like this is a little like making love to a porcupine - you have to be very careful. It has never been worth it to someone's reputation (however well-intentioned) or career to come out and say anything of this sort, political correctness is an asset, particularly for someone in his role and level. The framing and choice of language really did him in.

Re: Google parts with Cloud VP over his manifesto renouncing his antisemitism

#106

Post by lma21 » Sun, Jul 18, 2021, 12:00 PM UTC

adsche wrote: post #102

lma21 wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

isn't anti-semitic and anti-arab the same term? historically/technically speaking

No, and it never was. The term 'anti-semitic' always meant prejudiced against jews. This is not changed by the different meaning of 'semitic' in e.g. 'semitic languages'.

Oh, I didn't know that. Thanks for the info!

Re: Google parts with Cloud VP over his manifesto renouncing his antisemitism

#107

Post by spicyramen » Sun, Jul 18, 2021, 3:28 PM UTC

I think there is a basic rule at work: Don't mix politics and work. There are type of personal positions political, religious and sexual that are always controversial and is better to keep it to yourself. As a VP of DevRel he definitely should be focusing in work related topics as afaik Google isnt #1 Cloud there. In today's world we have been including sexual preferences as a norm for people to share at the workspace which has also triggered people and in my opinion we should keep it personal. In this case Awr is a VP who manages multiple people of Jewish origin. Looks like absolutely he has nothing better to do that decided that it was a good idea to write a blog post and record a video. This topic is not going to bring people together he really has very low emotional intelligence whatever his intention was. Good riddance

Re: Google parts with Cloud VP over his manifesto renouncing his antisemitism

#108

Post by spicyramen » Sun, Jul 18, 2021, 3:31 PM UTC

partiallypro wrote: post #9

I don't understand this new culture of not allowing people to have redemption. The past isn't the present or future. People change, that is what is so problematic with "cancel culture," and digging up old tweets, etc.

If you do it at personal level not representing a company is fine. But this dude thinks mixing politics and work is a good idea...being a VP. Clearly he lacks emotional intelligence or common sense.

Re: Google parts with Cloud VP over his manifesto renouncing his antisemitism

#109

Post by partiallypro » Mon, Jul 19, 2021, 5:24 PM UTC

spicyramen wrote: post #108

partiallypro wrote: post #9

I don't understand this new culture of not allowing people to have redemption. The past isn't the present or future. People change, that is what is so problematic with "cancel culture," and digging up old tweets, etc.

If you do it at personal level not representing a company is fine. But this dude thinks mixing politics and work is a good idea...being a VP. Clearly he lacks emotional intelligence or common sense.

Mixing politics and work is the new American corporate mantra (as long as its a certain strain of politics)

Re: Google parts with Cloud VP over his manifesto renouncing his antisemitism

#110

Post by raxxorrax » Thu, Jul 22, 2021, 10:18 AM UTC

mattzito wrote: post #56

mfer wrote: post #13

If we look at things in terms of positive and negative reinforcement this has some interesting consequences. So, he admitted to antisemitism in the past and shared how he has grown or is growing past it. This kind of admission by him has the ability to challenge other and positively reinforce others who are in a similar situation to him. That _positive_ reinforcement for change away from antisemitism. He was pushed o…

So, I'll start off by saying - I work at google, in cloud, but not for this person, I don't know anything about him, and this is my own opinion. I think if someone had asked him at an all hands for his position on the israel palestine conflict, and he said something like: "I grew up in a strict Egyptian Muslim household, indoctrinated to hate Israel and Jews, and it wasn't until I was exposed to jewish people and bec…

People who read the room to cater to an audience are never worth listening to, it is a waste of time. But in a corporate talk that is understandable as I think Google didn't have solving the middle eastern conflict on its agenda.

I still think your reaction to his opinion or view is a bit childish. But as I said, understandable in a corporate environment. The mistake was to give this opinion in an "official" position.

You should also refrain from stating your reaction in such a context.