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AMD 3rd Gen EPYC Milan Review

anandtech.com

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Re: AMD 3rd Gen EPYC Milan Review

#101

Post by MrFoof »

stillbourne wrote: post #11

I'm waiting for news on genesis peak, I'd love to get 4th gen threadripper on my next box.

Computex 2021, June 1st.

* Computex 2017 is when Zen Threadripper was announced.

* Computex 2019 is when Zen 2 Threadripper was announced.

* Computex 2020 is when Zen 2 Threadripper PRO was going to be announced. After the show was delayed, and then officially canceled, AMD did their own announcement shortly after.

So odds are it'll be Computex 2021 on June 1st. This fits in with the usual release timing, as Threadripper tends to follow EPYC by a few months. I'd expect retail channel availability for Threadripper as early as late July, as there's usually a few months between announce and channel availability.

Trust me, I've been waiting to build a 5970X as well. :)

Re: AMD 3rd Gen EPYC Milan Review

#102

Post by [deleted] »

ksec wrote: post #100
fomine3 wrote: post #91

This is most interesting part of interview posted at the same time. https://www.anandtech.com/show/16548/interview-with-amd-forr... > IC: While AMD increases the performance on its processor product line, the bandwidth out to DRAM remains constant. Is there an ideal intercept point where higher bandwidth memory makes sense for a customer? > FN: I think you’re absolutely right, and really at the top of the stack, depe…

They are still using GF 14nm on their IOD due to Wafer Supply Agreement. We will have to wait and see how they fit their iOD with PCI-Express 5 and DDR5 with Zen 4. And I cant wait to see Netflix plays around with these in their FreeBSD box. It is interesting the biggest upgrade from Zen 4 won't actually the Core part but the iOD. As I am expecting Zen 4 to be some tweaks and a Die Shrink to 5nm. TSMC also somehow un…

[deleted]

Re: AMD 3rd Gen EPYC Milan Review

#103

Post by kllrnohj »

fomine3 wrote: post #89
kllrnohj wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Epyc's idle power consumption is fairly high but Ryzen's isn't. The more workstation-focused Threadripper & Threadripper Pro is also still significantly better than Epyc here.

Is TR Pro really better? I suspect that it's just difference between motherboard because it's basically same as EPYC.

TBD on TR Pro using Zen 3, but TR Pro on Zen 2 appears to be a bit better than Epyc currently. I'd guess because optimizing idle power draw on TR Pro is a more worthwhile use of time vs. servers, where your fans are running at a bajillion RPM always anyway and you're not idle as much.

Re: AMD 3rd Gen EPYC Milan Review

#104

Post by kllrnohj »

bsoft16385 wrote: post #88
kllrnohj wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Epyc's idle power consumption is fairly high but Ryzen's isn't. The more workstation-focused Threadripper & Threadripper Pro is also still significantly better than Epyc here.

Zen2/Zen3-based, non-APU Ryzen still has pretty awful idle power consumption compared to Intel desktop CPUs. My 5900X at idle draws around 22W. Modern Intel desktop CPUs (which are basically all Skylake refreshes right now) are 8-10W at idle.

Sure, but 22W is still a trivial amount of heat & power in the form factor of a desktop system. Fans don't need to spin for that (or if they do it's at the lowest RPM - still silent). Fans do need to spin, and with some moderate oomph, to handle 80W, though.

Re: AMD 3rd Gen EPYC Milan Review

#105

Post by dragontamer »

derefr wrote: post #85
dragontamer wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are exceptions of course, but computers are a depreciating asset. You should never buy more computers than you need at any given time, because next year offers better computers for cheaper. Similarly: don't "invest" into a car. They also depreciate. In contrast: artwork, houses, and a few other goods (Magic: The Gathering cards?) seem to appreciate... or increase in price. These stuff you want to buy before the…

Yes, but isn't this exactly one of those exceptions? You need this exact model of X, Y, and Z, because those have been validated as a working combination through a huge one-time capital expenditure; and changing anything would entail going through that again. Vendors tend to not mark down prices for components, but rather just sell them for MSRP for as long as they can, and then immediately stop producing the item. T…

Hmmm... I don't think so.

Old process nodes (such as 130nm process, which is 100x larger than today's 12nm or 7nm processes) are still useful today. They're much cheaper to operate, because all the equipment is old and better understood (while 7nm and even 12nm processes are highly proprietary). Case in point: the Perseverance Rover that just landed on Mars is literally built from the ancient 130nm process. (POWER architecture)

Instead of ordering all the chips you need, you instead want to just ensure that the 130nm (or 45nm process, or 22nm process or whatever) will remain useful for 50 years into the future.

Lets say you base a modern government project (a spaceship, a jet fighter, a naval super carrier, etc. etc) off of a modern 14nm process node today.

1. You can order all the chips you'd "ever need" today, which is expensive today because tons of people are still using 14nm nodes.

2. Alternatively, you can order the company to continue to support the 14nm node for the next 50 years. This seems like the superior option. You order the chips you need later, when you need them. And 10 years from now, people will be on 3nm or maybe even 2nm process, so it'd be cheaper to order 2020-era 14nm chips at that point.

Re: AMD 3rd Gen EPYC Milan Review

#106

Post by meepmorp »

touisteur wrote: post #67
wtallis wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think 4U servers are quite rare these days, except for models designed to accommodate large numbers of either GPUs or 3.5" hard drives. Most 2-socket servers with up to a few dozen SSDs are 2U designs.

Y'all can try to pry my quad-cpu 3-upi 4U HPE DL.580 from my cold dead hands.

Nobody wants to throw their back out lifting that monster, so you win.

Re: AMD 3rd Gen EPYC Milan Review

#107

Post by Const-me »

ksec wrote: post #100
fomine3 wrote: post #91

This is most interesting part of interview posted at the same time. https://www.anandtech.com/show/16548/interview-with-amd-forr... > IC: While AMD increases the performance on its processor product line, the bandwidth out to DRAM remains constant. Is there an ideal intercept point where higher bandwidth memory makes sense for a customer? > FN: I think you’re absolutely right, and really at the top of the stack, depe…

They are still using GF 14nm on their IOD due to Wafer Supply Agreement. We will have to wait and see how they fit their iOD with PCI-Express 5 and DDR5 with Zen 4. And I cant wait to see Netflix plays around with these in their FreeBSD box. It is interesting the biggest upgrade from Zen 4 won't actually the Core part but the iOD. As I am expecting Zen 4 to be some tweaks and a Die Shrink to 5nm. TSMC also somehow un…

Core chiplets only send signal to I/O die, the distance is measured in mm and the parameters of these wires is tightly controlled by AMD.

I/O die sends signals to the rest of hardware. Wires are way longer, often with multiple connectors in them. I/O chiplet needs to produce and consume more of these milli-amps of electrical current.

One can produce larger transistors with finer processes e.g. by adding more fins to FinFETs, but since they need larger transistors anyway to handle more current, I’m not sure there’s much value in upgrading process of the I/O chiplet.

Re: AMD 3rd Gen EPYC Milan Review

#108

Post by stillbourne »

MrFoof wrote: post #101
stillbourne wrote: post #11

I'm waiting for news on genesis peak, I'd love to get 4th gen threadripper on my next box.

Computex 2021, June 1st. * Computex 2017 is when Zen Threadripper was announced. * Computex 2019 is when Zen 2 Threadripper was announced. * Computex 2020 is when Zen 2 Threadripper PRO was going to be announced. After the show was delayed, and then officially canceled, AMD did their own announcement shortly after. So odds are it'll be Computex 2021 on June 1st. This fits in with the usual release timing, as Threadri…

Dude, thanks, I've been looking for any scrap of rumor or release date.

Re: AMD 3rd Gen EPYC Milan Review

#109

Post by touisteur »

meepmorp wrote: post #106
touisteur wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Y'all can try to pry my quad-cpu 3-upi 4U HPE DL.580 from my cold dead hands.

Nobody wants to throw their back out lifting that monster, so you win.

:-) thanks, gunning for the 16 T4s to put in there, then.
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