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How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

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Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#101

Post by gruez »

aurizon wrote: post #45

Do not wear a 'shoot me' sign. Live hidden video, (2 cams, one points front and one points rear placed behind a plastic grommet it can see through - but is not alone, or buttonhole - make sure cam can not be seen and can not be blocked as you move, and blends in to clothing) stream to a friend-monitored cloud(that the friend can view, but not erase in case the friend is also grabbed). This will give you video your cl…

If your threat model includes police stingrays, the could also jam all cellphone traffic which makes cloud backups irrelevant.

Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#102

Post by xphilter »

microcolonel wrote: post #98
xphilter wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But again, that’s not the law (the executive order here). They can’t go enforce things not the law. It’s not like there are armed folks running around that street making exigent circumstances. Why do you feel the need to defend something obviously indefensible? Edit: just to be clear, given all the huff and puff by police of needing riot gear, armored trucks, giant guns, I haven’t seen any report in Minneapolis of an…

Dude, last night a federal officer was executed from a van. It wasn't in Minneapolis, but there's no reason to believe it couldn't be there. They gave an order: go inside while we're passing. It is a reasonable order for the few seconds or minutes it takes for the crowd to pass the neighbourhood. Remarkably, reasonable police orders apply to you, even if you are middle class and young.

Where? Do you have a link? Let’s assume that’s true, that a crime was committed across the country. Does that give this group of law enforcement to shoot ltl rounds at unarmed people on private property and in compliance with the law? I don’t understand your reasoning.

Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#103

Post by griffinkelly »

pmorici wrote: post #65
phalangion wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's because the National Guard isn't law enforcement.

That video wasn't of the national guard it was clearly police of some kind based on the uniforms. Also typically the national guard units they activate for stuff like this are often the MP units so they would be trained on law enforcement specific things. Either way it doesn't excuse or justify that blatant misconduct in the video.

I'm a member of the national guard and I, along with many of my friends, did not sign up to be police officers. That said, in Minnesota they called up every unit it seems. I'd understand civilians to easily confuse police with the military particularly after seeing a Humvee drive by, but if you take a closer look its easy to distinguish.

Also note, we take orders directly from the governor of the state, not the police, nor the president of the US unless activated.

Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#104

Post by vertex-four »

microcolonel wrote: post #98
xphilter wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But again, that’s not the law (the executive order here). They can’t go enforce things not the law. It’s not like there are armed folks running around that street making exigent circumstances. Why do you feel the need to defend something obviously indefensible? Edit: just to be clear, given all the huff and puff by police of needing riot gear, armored trucks, giant guns, I haven’t seen any report in Minneapolis of an…

Dude, last night a federal officer was executed from a van. It wasn't in Minneapolis, but there's no reason to believe it couldn't be there. They gave an order: go inside while we're passing. It is a reasonable order for the few seconds or minutes it takes for the crowd to pass the neighbourhood. Remarkably, reasonable police orders apply to you, even if you are middle class and young.

Reasonable police orders have to follow the law - the police cannot and should not be allowed to enforce things that are not the law. Of course, there's a presumption that they're in the right when they shoot you after you ignore an illegal order, and apparently you agree with that. Good luck with your freedoms.

Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#105

Post by eyelidlessness »

StellarTabi wrote: post #11

It's always ethical to film police misconduct, in fact what's unethical is that they're not already filming themselves. Safety is important, protesters (and even journalists...) have been livestreaming themselves innocently doing nothing (in contrast to other media's hyper-focusing on "looting") then getting shot with rubber bullets. One of them reportedly has permanent blindness in the left eye as a result. Police b…

> It's always ethical to film police misconduct

It is. What's not always ethical is to film and share identifiable features of people who are opposing it. The article discusses this. It should be discussed in much more detail. The history of police and vigilantes targeting people for harassment and retribution following mere involvement in protest against police brutality or abuse, especially targeting people of color who are already targeted for harassment and abuse by police, is as old as the force itself. The history of using video to identify targets is as old as access to film police brutality itself.

There are dozens of videos from the last several days of obvious, criminal abuse by police around the US. Some of it is obviously responsive to nothing the victims are doing, obviously retaliation for the mere fact that people are standing up against the murder that sparked this set of protests. If that's what they're doing on film, what are they willing to do after the fact, when eyes are on other problems, with carelessly published videos of the faces of organizers?

Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#106

Post by eyelidlessness »

roenxi wrote: post #20
samdamsamm wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tonight I witnessed a young girl get knocked out cold by a tear gas canister shot into her face from about a 40 ft. range. She was holding her hands up. There was nothing but peaceful protesters standing around, not blocking traffic. No vandalism anywhere in sight. This was in Louisville, KY. The police fired rubber bullets at the group of people carrying her away to a place on the other side of the line of humvees b…

> Everything most middle-income Americans think about our police forces is wrong. That statement is a bit vague, everyone is going to substitute their own interpretation in. The police don't target racial minorities because they are racist. People who want power over others sign up for policing - and then go after groups who have the least ability to fight back. The middle income might know the symptoms, but they are…

> The police don't target racial minorities because they are racist.

This is false. There is a long history of police membership in, involvement and collaboration with explicitly racist groups.

Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#107

Post by threatofrain »

eyelidlessness wrote: post #105
StellarTabi wrote: post #11

It's always ethical to film police misconduct, in fact what's unethical is that they're not already filming themselves. Safety is important, protesters (and even journalists...) have been livestreaming themselves innocently doing nothing (in contrast to other media's hyper-focusing on "looting") then getting shot with rubber bullets. One of them reportedly has permanent blindness in the left eye as a result. Police b…

> It's always ethical to film police misconduct It is. What's not always ethical is to film and share identifiable features of people who are opposing it. The article discusses this. It should be discussed in much more detail. The history of police and vigilantes targeting people for harassment and retribution following mere involvement in protest against police brutality or abuse, especially targeting people of colo…

The end game is police bring drones to every protest, so the dilemma will fade in time.

Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#108

Post by eternalban »

fsloth wrote: post #32
roenxi wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Everything most middle-income Americans think about our police forces is wrong. That statement is a bit vague, everyone is going to substitute their own interpretation in. The police don't target racial minorities because they are racist. People who want power over others sign up for policing - and then go after groups who have the least ability to fight back. The middle income might know the symptoms, but they are…

It's hardly inescapable. Police in the nordic countries acts and behaves more or less as a service branch of the government rather as a bully. But they have several years of training whereas US has only - what, a few months? I would say it's about skimping costs in the wrong place. US system is weird that in it's local search of frugal solutions it creates inefficient systems (like the medical sector).

US police have been receiving advanced training in Israel. The changes in tactics, gear, are all part of this training.

This incident in MN with United States citizens getting shot at on their own porch is a much milder form of thuggery — it was not legal application of force — that Palestinians have been living with for decades.

Karma.

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/joint-us-israel-police-...

Re: How to Safely and Ethically Film Police Misconduct

#109

Post by threatofrain »

eyelidlessness wrote: post #106
roenxi wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Everything most middle-income Americans think about our police forces is wrong. That statement is a bit vague, everyone is going to substitute their own interpretation in. The police don't target racial minorities because they are racist. People who want power over others sign up for policing - and then go after groups who have the least ability to fight back. The middle income might know the symptoms, but they are…

> The police don't target racial minorities because they are racist. This is false. There is a long history of police membership in, involvement and collaboration with explicitly racist groups.

Racism is in all our hearts — what’s important is in developing calm relations with your own strengths and weaknesses so that you can work on yourself if you choose.

Embracing this human weakness is part of developing the structures to keep us accountable.

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