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Django 2.2

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Re: Django 2.2

#101

Post by acomjean »

sarcasmOrTears wrote: post #17
chickenfries wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re right, it is very silly of you. I might even say you’re the one being over sensitive.

Not as sensitive as people downvoting the poor guy's opinion to oblivion

It’s probably not helping that the username is “ecmascript” on a python post.

When I first started getting into database I found the terminology a little jarring. I know it’s common and the intention is ok, still not a big fan.

But the python community should be ok with renaming things: frankly Lists are just arrays and dictionary’s are hash tables

Re: Django 2.2

#102

Post by Godel_unicode »

sparkling wrote: post #28
Alex3917 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Django is still by far the best web framework as far as I can tell. Every couple years I check what's out there for GoLang, Rust, Nodejs, and Swift, and it seems like it will be a decade or more before anything else comes even close. Even though a lot of people don't like Django's ORM, at least it does almost everything you would want to do with Postgres. (And if you want more you can always use SqlAlchemy.) Most of…

I have used both Ruby on Rails and Django in large production web applications over 2+ years. Speaking strictly about the web framework, RoR is the slightly better framework IMHO. This includes but is not limited to: - cleaner internal APIs, models, methods - a lot more stuff that "just works" out of the box where you would need a third-party package in Django (e.g. RoR gives you different settings for development/st…

> better static file handling

Don't you just let nginx/CDN handle these?

Re: Django 2.2

#103

Post by dcbadacd »

zimablue wrote: post #98
trpc wrote: post #85

Whenever I see people still praising Django in 2019, I immediately know that their technical understanding of the current backend and ops technologies is years behind. Django is still okay for small and amateur projects but nothing more than that. It is a curse for a fast moving business. EDIT: even though I stopped writing Django for 3 years now but here are some of my reasons as far as I can remember: 1. mediocre r…

This post is very antagonistic but I can say that point 3 rings very true, even using advanced/data heavy SQL got very annoying for me relative to SQLAlchemy and I don't think you really want to try and pull it out.

I second to this, SQLAlchemy was nicer to use when my data model wasn't super simple and used PostgreSQL specific features.

Re: Django 2.2

#104

Post by danpalmer »

bluedino wrote: post #42

The projects/app relationship never 'clicked' with me. I also have a dislike for the awkward 'polls' example in the django tutorial. That said, I like Django. Of course, I liked Rails better, but maybe that's because it was my 'first' and I never used any of the big php frameworks for a long period of time. I quit wasting my time with Flask for projects a while ago. It's a really great project and suited for smaller…

We split into multiple apps within one project/site for separation of concerns instead of reusability. We have ~370 apps and nest them quite heavily, probably ~30 at the top level. This works well for us and we've managed to scale nicely to 15 people working on the codebase quite nicely.

Re: Django 2.2

#105

Post by rochacon »

neves wrote: post #74

I'm a fan of Django, but I'm in doubt if I must still use it for my new project. I'll develop now an hybrid app that will start life as an mobile web site. I'll use one javascript framework and I'm really in doubt about using Django. If I use a javascript server framework, I believe that it will prevent me to duplicate forms validation code (in server in frontend) and also easier for SSR (Server Side Rendering). But…

IMHO, code sharing between the frontend and backend is very hard to do properly and you have more changes of making stuff too generic and unmaintanable faster. KISS

As any new project, go with you're most comfortable with, so you can prototype and changes things faster. After you reach a good size and understanding of the problem you may refactor stuff for a different language/framework with better reasons for it.

That being said, if you want to use Python but not a "batteries included" framework like Django, so you have better control of the stack, check out Pyramid, it is really good and scales (I'm talking on code maintainability, but also performance-wise) very well from pet-project phase to complex applications.

Re: Django 2.2

#106

Post by kickopotomus »

rlander wrote: post #47
fredley wrote: post #22

Django/Jupyter/pandas is an ecosystem that's hard to beat. If you're not already using it, check out `django-extensions`. You can use `./manage.py shell_plus --notebook` to launch a Django-friendly Jupyter notebook. From there you can prototype with extreme ease and confidence. I have also built a trivial custom model Manager so I can do stuff like: User.objects.all().to_dataframe("first_name", "last_name", "email")…

You just discovered repl driven development that lisp users have been advocating for years. Check it out in Clojure: https://vvvvalvalval.github.io/posts/what-makes-a-good-repl....

I think ipython/jupyter notebooks are more analogous to Clojure's REBL[0][1], which is very cool but not nearly as mature.

[0]: https://github.com/cognitect-labs/REBL-distro

[1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c52QhiXsmyI

Re: Django 2.2

#107

Post by dang »

mlevental wrote: post #26
rat9988 wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you feel the need to attack him? It's not as if he has attacked you personally.

i don't understand the bipolar nature of hn. "don't be afraid to be intellectually honest and say what needs to be said - we're not afraid of hurting people's feelings for the greater good and we're proud of it" and at the same time "be careful you don't say anything that could in the slightest be misinterpreted as impugning someone's character" i feel like i'm taking crazy pills? this is exactly the kind of thing th…

HN isn't a person, it's a distribution of millions of people. If you think of it as a statistical cloud, it won't seem so paradoxical (e.g. "bipolar").

I don't follow your reference to Nietzsche but if it's relevant here, the same point would surely apply to any group. I try not to lose too much sleep over problems with HN that stem from humans in general. It's hard enough to change the few things we can.

Re: Django 2.2

#108

Post by ablerman »

driverdan wrote: post #93
Alex3917 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With Python you get: - The best-governed language in all of software, and the best-governed web framework - A huge ecosystem of libraries for everything from data science to email processing, that are (mostly) easy to read and modify and free from systemic security issues. And pretty much every major company with an API has an official Python library for that API. - The standard language taught at most of the top CS…

I've spent years using Rails and about a year with Django. In general find Rails to be more logical and less cumbersome. Django feels more cobbled together than Rails, with less cohesiveness. Sorry that these are fairly abstract statements without examples. I need to start tracking them.

I find this comment interesting because my experience is the exact opposite. (I won't bore you or tempt the trolls with details) I don't mean to downplay your experience at all. My working theory is that you just think the way the rails devs do and I think the way the Django devs do.

Re: Django 2.2

#109

Post by travisjungroth »

digitaltrees wrote: post #72
bluedino wrote: post #42

The projects/app relationship never 'clicked' with me. I also have a dislike for the awkward 'polls' example in the django tutorial. That said, I like Django. Of course, I liked Rails better, but maybe that's because it was my 'first' and I never used any of the big php frameworks for a long period of time. I quit wasting my time with Flask for projects a while ago. It's a really great project and suited for smaller…

I feel the same way. Does any one have a good overview on how the community actually separates functionality into “apps”? I have been looking at a rails like framework in python called Masonite. Does anyone in the python/Django community think this will gain traction?

The separate apps thing is overblown (although that sentiment seems to be shared in these comments). If you're making a monolith web app, you can be safe just chucking it into one django app. If you're concerned about code organization, you can do that in one app with either sub apps or just turning files into packages later. I think this is a more productive strategy for django beginners.

If you've identified some clean, generic problem where you want to reuse the code or open source it, make it a separate app. If you have a web site with areas that barely interact with each other, make it into separate apps (a chef's website where the recipes are separate from the cooking classes calendar). If you know what you're doing and feel like separate apps will help with organization, then split them up as well. Otherwise, one is fine.

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