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Django 2.2

djangoproject.com

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Re: Django 2.2

#21

Post by zimablue »

ecmascript wrote: post #4

Django is a great framework and it's probably very silly of me but I still cannot let go of the master/slave fiasco a couple of years ago. https://github.com/django/django/pull/2692 A framework that have deciding collaborators that is that sensitive / politically correct is not something I'm willing to invest my time on any more.

Thanks, I hadn't seen this it's amazing. It's off topic but interesting enough not to mind. It set me on a train of thought about whether github is accidentally dystopic => permanent, completely public record of everything you say or do (inside the platform), conditions that probably magnify the power of social victimizing. PRs are permanent, I don't know about the discussions/etc, they can be deleted? Whilst being also a public record of your work/skills, so you can't really opt out or anonymize without a significant penalty.

Re: Django 2.2

#22

Post by fredley »

Django/Jupyter/pandas is an ecosystem that's hard to beat.

If you're not already using it, check out `django-extensions`. You can use `./manage.py shell_plus --notebook` to launch a Django-friendly Jupyter notebook.

From there you can prototype with extreme ease and confidence.

I have also built a trivial custom model Manager so I can do stuff like:

    User.objects.all().to_dataframe("first_name", "last_name", "email")
Honestly I can't see myself being even slightly tempted to move to something else unless I can replicate this workflow.

Re: Django 2.2

#23

Post by ecmascript »

zimablue wrote: post #21
ecmascript wrote: post #4

Django is a great framework and it's probably very silly of me but I still cannot let go of the master/slave fiasco a couple of years ago. https://github.com/django/django/pull/2692 A framework that have deciding collaborators that is that sensitive / politically correct is not something I'm willing to invest my time on any more.

Thanks, I hadn't seen this it's amazing. It's off topic but interesting enough not to mind. It set me on a train of thought about whether github is accidentally dystopic => permanent, completely public record of everything you say or do (inside the platform), conditions that probably magnify the power of social victimizing. PRs are permanent, I don't know about the discussions/etc, they can be deleted? Whilst being a…

Well yes, I don't mind that they have a different world view than me. What I do mind is when people enforce their world views upon me.

I always opt out if possibly in those scenarios, just as I did with Django. I stopped using it and now I have nothing that runs Django anymore.

Re: Django 2.2

#24

Post by airstrike »

ecmascript wrote: post #20
airstrike wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As questionable as that PR may be, it's hardly enough to justify outright dismissing one of the most successful web frameworks out there. But at the end of the day, the choice is yours to make and it's simply your loss.

I tend to invest in people / companies rather than a technology. There are an abundance of good web frameworks out there so it's not like you're gonna have a bad time just because you don't use a specific one.

The people behind Django are one of the sharpest set of developers out there. Just hang out the django-developers mailing list for a bit and you'll likely conclude the same. Don't let this one PR color your entire judgement of an otherwise incredibly successful and polished piece of software.

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/django-developers

Re: Django 2.2

#25

Post by ecmascript »

chickenfries wrote: post #6
ecmascript wrote: post #4

Django is a great framework and it's probably very silly of me but I still cannot let go of the master/slave fiasco a couple of years ago. https://github.com/django/django/pull/2692 A framework that have deciding collaborators that is that sensitive / politically correct is not something I'm willing to invest my time on any more.

You’re right, it is very silly of you. I might even say you’re the one being over sensitive.

Thanks for proving my point, your mentality is the perfect example of why I think it's great to stay as far away as possible from PC-people :)

Re: Django 2.2

#26

Post by mlevental »

rat9988 wrote: post #18
chickenfries wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re right, it is very silly of you. I might even say you’re the one being over sensitive.

Why do you feel the need to attack him? It's not as if he has attacked you personally.

i don't understand the bipolar nature of hn.

"don't be afraid to be intellectually honest and say what needs to be said - we're not afraid of hurting people's feelings for the greater good and we're proud of it"

and at the same time

"be careful you don't say anything that could in the slightest be misinterpreted as impugning someone's character"

i feel like i'm taking crazy pills? this is exactly the kind of thing that Nietzsche talked about in geneaology of morals: people in this "community" claim to be above petty politics and egalitarian but as soon as anyone points out anything that even remotely contradicts that image they get silenced or shouted down (e.g. bringing up race or gender politics and their role in the entrepreneur mythology).

it's completely within the scope of productive discourse to point out to someone that they're being irrational because no discourse can proceed until a rational framework is established. case in point: a rational discussion of the merits of django cannot begin from "i'm prejudiced against them because they made questionable PR choices".

honestly there are so few useful discussions on hn. the tech posts are either PR for yc companies or another js vdom framework and the culture posts are all mostly rehashings of the same neoliberal arguments for capital and culture etc. the few people that try to inject any heterogeneity of thought get vilified.

Re: Django 2.2

#27

Post by bredren »

amerine wrote: post #2

Nice. Anyone building fun stuff using Django these days?

I’m building my first product that has actually made money and shows signs of real potential in Django. I’m about 3 years into it.

It is growing just among beta customers. Hope to do a release in next month or so. Will post a Show HN.

I also have a client I develop for on a private web app in Django that does a lot of cool stuff w on the fly cloud compute instantiation.

I really like Django and have been hanging out in the #django on freenode.

Re: Django 2.2

#28

Post by sparkling »

Alex3917 wrote: post #8
amerine wrote: post #2

Nice. Anyone building fun stuff using Django these days?

Django is still by far the best web framework as far as I can tell. Every couple years I check what's out there for GoLang, Rust, Nodejs, and Swift, and it seems like it will be a decade or more before anything else comes even close. Even though a lot of people don't like Django's ORM, at least it does almost everything you would want to do with Postgres. (And if you want more you can always use SqlAlchemy.) Most of…

I have used both Ruby on Rails and Django in large production web applications over 2+ years. Speaking strictly about the web framework, RoR is the slightly better framework IMHO. This includes but is not limited to:

- cleaner internal APIs, models, methods

- a lot more stuff that "just works" out of the box where you would need a third-party package in Django (e.g. RoR gives you different settings for development/staging/production out of the box)

- better static file handling

- third-party packages tend to be a bit more mature and stable in the RoR world

However, using Django gives you easy access to the rest of the Python ecosystem, including all the data science and ML tooling. And that trade is worth it. So if you are starting from scratch today, i'd go with Django.

Re: Django 2.2

#29

Post by ecmascript »

airstrike wrote: post #24
ecmascript wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tend to invest in people / companies rather than a technology. There are an abundance of good web frameworks out there so it's not like you're gonna have a bad time just because you don't use a specific one.

The people behind Django are one of the sharpest set of developers out there. Just hang out the django-developers mailing list for a bit and you'll likely conclude the same. Don't let this one PR color your entire judgement of an otherwise incredibly successful and polished piece of software. https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/django-developers

> The people behind Django are one of the sharpest set of developers out there.

That may be, but it doesn't really matter to me if they put their political views into their code. It can literally be the best framework out there, built by the sharpest minds in the world and I would still use another framework even if it would hurt me economically.

Re: Django 2.2

#30

Post by vertex-four »

ecmascript wrote: post #29
airstrike wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The people behind Django are one of the sharpest set of developers out there. Just hang out the django-developers mailing list for a bit and you'll likely conclude the same. Don't let this one PR color your entire judgement of an otherwise incredibly successful and polished piece of software. https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/django-developers

> The people behind Django are one of the sharpest set of developers out there. That may be, but it doesn't really matter to me if they put their political views into their code. It can literally be the best framework out there, built by the sharpest minds in the world and I would still use another framework even if it would hurt me economically.

Deciding to accept the status quo is also a political decision reflective of one’s political views. The issue here is that you don’t agree with this particular view, not that it is a political view.
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