Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

reuters.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

101–110 of 111 posts

Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#101

Post by dilemma »

pizzetta wrote: post #59
coldtea wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Newbie question but what is China's rationale for their internet censorship and firewall? What are they afraid of? Aside from the CCP wanting to maintain its control in-land, there's this little real issue, that 80% the internet is mostly controlled from a handful of companies, all in the hands of foreign nationals (who are all "patriotic" and all reside in countries other than China). That is, things like search,…

I think the Answer is yes. We had no issue with Nokia or Toyota. We consume Anime. Lots of companies use Kaspersky despite apparent ties to RU intelligence services. There is some talk of the DoD pulling out from a contract --but that's DoD and I imagine Chinese version of DoD would do something similar.

But you do have a problem with Huawei.

Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#102

Post by Baeocystin »

schoen wrote: post #71
E6300 wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> drivers who accidentally hit a pedestrian are actually incentivise to backup to make sure to kill the pedestrians Why?

Mostly based on a 2015 Slate article which might not be accurate (in terms of proven cases, as opposed to people's familiarity with the concept). http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/foreigners/2... http://www.snopes.com/chinese-drivers-kill-pedestrians/

Speaking as someone who lived in China for many years: one of the biggest culture-shock differences Westerners (and particularly Americans) experience in Chinese cities is how people will straight up refuse to help strangers they don't know.

This is not because Chinese people are dicks. Frankly, if you're a (white) foreigner, you're going to be treated better than average by almost everyone as it is. But people hold back, because helping other people has the potential to have huge negative consequences if you get involved.

Here in the states, people are amazingly open to helping someone they've never met. This cultural assumption works because everyone 'just knows' that the person helping is not responsible for anything beyond that particular interaction. We even have Good Samaritan laws on the books that ensure that it is legally safe to do your best to render assistance in extreme circumstances.

It is the complete opposite in China. If you help someone, it is assumed that you are taking responsibility for their entire problem. (Yes, I am oversimplifying, there's more to it than this. But this is an accurate general gist.)

I don't know anything about this fellow, but this particular video of his, at least, does an excellent job explaining what is going on:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Y4vXYfa06k

He is talking about the modern experience, but it is the same as what I remember from the 80's. The only thing I disagree with him about is that I do not see it as a new phenomenon.

Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#103

Post by Baeocystin »

mistermann wrote: post #66
_ptgt wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the biggest (possibly THE biggest) economic issue facing China in the near future is a demographic crisis resulting from the One Child Policy. A large part of China's economic growth has been the result of the growth of its workforce. Historically, Mao believed "people are power" and encouraged high birth rates--leading to China's gigantic present-day population. This has worked out great in making China an at…

Is it not true though that a massive portion of the country remains unindustrialized, so even if on a percentage basis the population is aging, in absolute numbers there will still be plenty of young people from the farms that could take the place of the current manufacturing workforce?

It is not. It is also a matter of education: many of the rural poor would simply not be able to take over non-manual-labor jobs. The severe sex ratio imbalance that resulted from the OCP has also had significant, negative effects on relationships in general.

https://www.economist.com/news/asia/21648715-distorted-sex-r...

Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#104

Post by Baeocystin »

KaoruAoiShiho wrote: post #95
woodandsteel wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The question is not how far China has come in recent decades, it is what is going to happen in the future. You seem to be taking the position that it is absolutely impossible that China will get in serious trouble and wind up going backwards.

Why would it? Aside from a black swan like a war or a super disease or something. The common list of problems I see are all problems that China always had and like I said, still grew despite those problems. Every single problem I see is becoming less problematic and any tiny bit of progress on them are tailwinds for growth.

The 'Great Leap Forward' killed more people than the entire population of Canada. And that was only a handful of decades ago. The party that did so maintains an iron grasp on power, and corruption at all levels is rampant.

There are many, many Chinese who are working very hard for the betterment of their country, and there are many, many wonderful things about China. But it is virtually impossible to overestimate the difficulties they are going to be facing in the coming years. Their economic success, by becoming the manufacturing powerhouse of the world, has come at tremendous cost, and is not maintainable in the long term. We live in interesting times.

Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#105

Post by Baeocystin »

KaoruAoiShiho wrote: post #94
em3rgent0rdr wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't disagree with that. But I do think the lack of free speech/press/elections is a basic foundational problem which will hamper progress on the rest of these problems.

It probably does hamper progress, but China never had free speech since the cultural revolution so it's not like things can get worse, the free speech situation is still much improved from the 70s and the 90s (the 80s were a rare period of relatively free speech). So any political changes will be yet another turbo boost on the economy.

>so it's not like things can get worse

I admire your optimism, but this has yet to be an accurate statement across the entirety of human civilization.

Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#106

Post by em3rgent0rdr »

Baeocystin wrote: post #102
schoen wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mostly based on a 2015 Slate article which might not be accurate (in terms of proven cases, as opposed to people's familiarity with the concept). http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/foreigners/2... http://www.snopes.com/chinese-drivers-kill-pedestrians/

Speaking as someone who lived in China for many years: one of the biggest culture-shock differences Westerners (and particularly Americans) experience in Chinese cities is how people will straight up refuse to help strangers they don't know. This is not because Chinese people are dicks. Frankly, if you're a (white) foreigner, you're going to be treated better than average by almost everyone as it is. But people hold…

I've been in China off and on from 2003-2008, and I've also noticed the phenomenon this video describes whereby people do NOT help out strangers in need, but never really knew the legal why. I always just assumed it was a cultural aspect I was told (can't find the name of it) whereby if you are not part of a Chinese person's social network, then you are effectively irrelevant to them, which was the reason why you should never be offended when people don't wave or smile back at you.

But anyway, I'm not optimistic considering the legal/cultural reasons for the pedestrian issue and the "Broken Vase Scam" in the video will get applied to bigger social challenges.

Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#107

Post by em3rgent0rdr »

Baeocystin wrote: post #102
schoen wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mostly based on a 2015 Slate article which might not be accurate (in terms of proven cases, as opposed to people's familiarity with the concept). http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/foreigners/2... http://www.snopes.com/chinese-drivers-kill-pedestrians/

Speaking as someone who lived in China for many years: one of the biggest culture-shock differences Westerners (and particularly Americans) experience in Chinese cities is how people will straight up refuse to help strangers they don't know. This is not because Chinese people are dicks. Frankly, if you're a (white) foreigner, you're going to be treated better than average by almost everyone as it is. But people hold…

watching some more of this YouTuber's videos...interesting stuff...autoplay sent me to this other scam described as:

"driving in China can be really frustrating sometimes. Now China has a problem with people baiting each other to break the law so that you can break the law and they can claim a reward. This is blackmail and extortion inCARnate"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7auIEiTRZI

Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#108

Post by pizzetta »

dilemma wrote: post #101
pizzetta wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the Answer is yes. We had no issue with Nokia or Toyota. We consume Anime. Lots of companies use Kaspersky despite apparent ties to RU intelligence services. There is some talk of the DoD pulling out from a contract --but that's DoD and I imagine Chinese version of DoD would do something similar.

But you do have a problem with Huawei.

Do you mean people buying phones, or do you mean some enterprises (and govt's like India) weary of their Firmware backdoors?

Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#109

Post by dilemma »

pizzetta wrote: post #108
dilemma wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But you do have a problem with Huawei.

Do you mean people buying phones, or do you mean some enterprises (and govt's like India) weary of their Firmware backdoors?

I mean governments like the US government.

Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#110

Post by KaoruAoiShiho »

Baeocystin wrote: post #104
KaoruAoiShiho wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would it? Aside from a black swan like a war or a super disease or something. The common list of problems I see are all problems that China always had and like I said, still grew despite those problems. Every single problem I see is becoming less problematic and any tiny bit of progress on them are tailwinds for growth.

The 'Great Leap Forward' killed more people than the entire population of Canada . And that was only a handful of decades ago. The party that did so maintains an iron grasp on power, and corruption at all levels is rampant. There are many, many Chinese who are working very hard for the betterment of their country, and there are many, many wonderful things about China. But it is virtually impossible to overestimate th…

You still didn't list a single thing :p
Post reply on HN