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Norway: 37% of new vehicles sold in January were electric

electrek.co

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Re: Norway: 37% of new vehicles sold in January were electric

#101

Post by dingaling »

maxsilver wrote: post #51
paganel wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ICE vehicles are still considerably cheaper compared to EV. Show me a 10,000-15,000 euro electric hatchback that I'd be able to drive for 10+ years without having to purchase expensive batteries every 4-5 years and I'd buy it.

A Used Renault Zoe can be bought for well under 10k EUR. In five years, replace the battery for an extra ~5K EUR (you probably won't need to, my EV battery is 4+ years old with 50k miles on it and still works great, but we'll include it in the cost just to calm your fears) Even including a brand new battery, total cost is still well below your 15K EUR max budget, using real-world numbers you can actually purchase wit…

> A Used Renault Zoe can be bought for well under 10k EUR.

Bear in mind that with many examples of Renault and Nissan EVs, you also have to pay a mandatory monthly battery leasing fee - even as the second or subsequent owner. So the headline purchase cost is only part of the price.

There are some Zoes, and a larger proportion of Leafs, in which the battery is owned outright but one has to check before purchasing.

Re: Norway: 37% of new vehicles sold in January were electric

#102

Post by nextos »

_delirium wrote: post #84
Strom wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What limitations are there for just using a German registered car? That's one of the main arguments that is being brought up here in Estonia when the socialists try to create a car registration tax. The opponents claim that people will just go a bit south to Latvia and register their car there, and then just drive around with a Latvian registration. There aren't any restrictions that prohibit this. Similar behavior e…

You can drive a German-registered car as a tourist who isn't resident in Denmark, but if you move to Denmark and become a resident (or already were resident), you must register the car in Denmark within 30 days of bringing it into the country [1]. But yes, some amount of this happens. The easiest case to get away with it is probably if you are actually from another EU country, and just keep it registered in your home…

You can't drive a foreign car if you are a permanent resident in Denmark, I think. People in my workplace used to try what you suggest, but it doesn't work. If police stops you and they discover you are in fact living in Denmark you will get an enormous fine.

Leasing is usually a better deal in this case. You can get a small car for around 1500 kr / month.

Re: Norway: 37% of new vehicles sold in January were electric

#103

Post by ptaipale »

Tade0 wrote: post #97
_delirium wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can drive a German-registered car as a tourist who isn't resident in Denmark, but if you move to Denmark and become a resident (or already were resident), you must register the car in Denmark within 30 days of bringing it into the country [1]. But yes, some amount of this happens. The easiest case to get away with it is probably if you are actually from another EU country, and just keep it registered in your home…

I wonder what happens if you're leasing the car? Technically it's not your property, so you can't register it. I'm sure there's some kind of mechanism to prevent people from driving cars leased in another country, but how does it work?

You're just not allowed to drive that car in the country. The European Union common market and free movement of goods doesn't apply to cars when the tax revenue of governments is at stake. Finland has had a somewhat similar car taxation as Denmark, and here the government breaks EU law at will; when some procedure is ruled illegal by EU courts, the government replaces it with a new wording and the circus starts all over. No official is ever held accountable.

How does police find those who drive a foreign vehicle illegally? Stop a vehicle in foreign plates, ask driver's license; if it is a local national driving, investigate. Police have very much powers in Nordic countries for these cases (they can always stop a car and investigate, there's no American type requirement for a probable cause.)

And of course, there are always people who report suspected tax evaders to the police.

There used to be a sort of a hunt for these cases between Sweden (who has no car sales tax) and Finland. E.g. there was a guy who lived in Haparanda on Swedish side and had a girlfriend in Tornio on the Finnish side, and stayed too many nights at the girlfriend's place. He got a big fine and had to pay back taxes because he should have registered himself as a local resident and imported and registered the car to Finland as well, including paying the car import tax.

I sold my first car to a Norwegian friend. It was a wreck so I sold it for the equivalent of 50 € (this was 1990). The friend then moved back to Oslo. She was asked to pay the equivalent of about 2000 € in car tax to register it in Norway. She gave it for scrap instead, of course.

Re: Norway: 37% of new vehicles sold in January were electric

#104

Post by stuckagain »

valuearb wrote: post #91
svantana wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You do realize that taxes don't just disappear, right? Tax revenue pays for things like child care, health care, universities etc. That means the average consumer can spend more on frivolous things even if they are more expensive. So yeah us Scandinavians are living a pretty sweet life :)

You pay for child care, health care and universities, whether through taxes or your pocketbook. Paying through your pocket book just means you have freedom of choice.

In America we have low taxes but not choice. You can choose to drive in America but you cannot choose to ride the high speed rail instead. Our choices are limited by our regime.

Re: Norway: 37% of new vehicles sold in January were electric

#105

Post by TheAdamAndChe »

jagger27 wrote: post #68
flurdy wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think widespread charging plugs in apartment complexes and car parks come with demand and some encouragement with tax breaks over time. People that may already have an EV will prefer complexes with available plugs when moving flats, the government may encourage new complexes to add plugs by default, etc. But it may take time if not general incentives to increase market share of EV are made. I know by my parents 'ho…

> the government may encourage new complexes to add plugs by default, etc. No need. Any semi-premium builder is more than happy to add features to their spec sheet, and 240V outlets are nothing special. Retro-fitting older places is where things get expensive and iffy.

Keyword: semi-premium. Electric vehicles are only accessible to the rich at the moment. We need to make it possible for poorer people to get electric vehicles too.

Re: Norway: 37% of new vehicles sold in January were electric

#106

Post by svantana »

valuearb wrote: post #91
svantana wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You do realize that taxes don't just disappear, right? Tax revenue pays for things like child care, health care, universities etc. That means the average consumer can spend more on frivolous things even if they are more expensive. So yeah us Scandinavians are living a pretty sweet life :)

You pay for child care, health care and universities, whether through taxes or your pocketbook. Paying through your pocket book just means you have freedom of choice.

Unless you don't have enough money to pay for those things, of course. And that is the whole point of the system.

Re: Norway: 37% of new vehicles sold in January were electric

#107

Post by vilmosi »

valuearb wrote: post #91
svantana wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You do realize that taxes don't just disappear, right? Tax revenue pays for things like child care, health care, universities etc. That means the average consumer can spend more on frivolous things even if they are more expensive. So yeah us Scandinavians are living a pretty sweet life :)

You pay for child care, health care and universities, whether through taxes or your pocketbook. Paying through your pocket book just means you have freedom of choice.

Choice of what? I don't really care what brand my antibiotics are. Whether the government pays for it via taxes or me out of pocket, I only care if they work.

Same with universities, vacation, labour laws etc...

Re: Norway: 37% of new vehicles sold in January were electric

#108

Post by snom380 »

ptaipale wrote: post #61
kwhitefoot wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not a joke at all. Oslo gets more sun than Hamburg. Also take a look at the Energibygg: https://translate.google.no/translate?hl=en&sl=no&u=https://...

The problem is that Oslo, like all the Nordics, gets more sun in the summer when it's less necessary, and practically none in the winter when energy is needed. Norway has so much hydroelectric capacity that it doesn't matter, though.

The nice thing about hydroelectric is that the energy you use from photovoltaics during the summer means you don't have to drain the dams as much during summer, which means you'll have more power in store for winter (unless you've decided to sell it to Europe first). There's also at least one hydroelectric plant in Norway that supports storing energy by pumping water into the basin, although that feature is rarely used.
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