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Mac's command key is worse than Window's ctrl

news.ycombinator.com

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Re: Mac's command key is worse than Window's ctrl

#11

Post by Someone »

So, you trained your pinky for years, possibly decades, so that it became second nature to exert enough pressure on the control key even though that requires a “pinky stretch”, while letting your thumb atrophy by only using it to press the space bar, and now are surprised that it is easier for you to hit control than command?

Can you imagine that other people who did the reverse may have a different opinion?

I’m firm in the “on most keyboards, the control keys are way to far out to be useful” camp, and don’t see how bending a thumb a tiny bit to hit the command key can be less ergonomic than sending your pink out on an expedition.

Re: Mac's command key is worse than Window's ctrl

#13

Post by coreyw56 »

Someone wrote: post #11

So, you trained your pinky for years, possibly decades, so that it became second nature to exert enough pressure on the control key even though that requires a “pinky stretch”, while letting your thumb atrophy by only using it to press the space bar, and now are surprised that it is easier for you to hit control than command? Can you imagine that other people who did the reverse may have a different opinion? I’m firm…

Personally, I think it's the stretching a finger in the direction it's pointed towards vs. bending a finger that crosses under other fingers. I find the first to feel much more natural. Although I've been a Mac user for years now and have gotten used to the cmd key, ergonomically, I think ctrl makes more sense.

Re: Mac's command key is worse than Window's ctrl

#14

Post by greazy »

dekhn wrote: post #5
greazy wrote: post #4

I find the opposite. Use your thumb for the command key not your pinky finger. My frustration is the function (fn) key placement. Just terrible.

but with the thumb on command, you have to contort your fingers to hit any of the alphabet keys.

I agree you still have to contort your hand but it is significantly less movement than using your pinky.

IMO you should remap your keys: https://karabiner-elements.pqrs.org/

Every system will not be 100% to your liking, so make it work for you.

Re: Mac's command key is worse than Window's ctrl

#15

Post by nextos »

> Windows is so much more consistent for what the ctrl key does [...]

On Macs, Cmd is for GUI and Ctrl is for sending control sequences in a terminal, as originally intended by Unix.

As a Linux user, I found this separation fairly consistent and a good idea.

Re: Mac's command key is worse than Window's ctrl

#16

Post by Doxin »

Someone wrote: post #11

So, you trained your pinky for years, possibly decades, so that it became second nature to exert enough pressure on the control key even though that requires a “pinky stretch”, while letting your thumb atrophy by only using it to press the space bar, and now are surprised that it is easier for you to hit control than command? Can you imagine that other people who did the reverse may have a different opinion? I’m firm…

With my pinky on left control I can reach from A to K. With my thumb on command I can reach from A to J. With my pinky on command I can reach from A to L, though reaching A contorts my wrist in a way where doing that too much is gonna get me a real sore wrist real quick.

I've got to conclude that the reach between control and command are approximately the same, more than half the keyboard for me in any case at which point you should to switch using control or command on the right side of the keyboard, or using your other hand to press the second button.

Personally my biggest gripe with command over control is that a bunch of software still uses control on macos, giving a rather inconsistent user experience.

Re: Mac's command key is worse than Window's ctrl

#17

Post by lesserknowndan »

bediger4000 wrote: post #12

What I can't get used to is no mouse button paste in either MacOS or Windows. The X11 all-mouse copy-n-paste is so much more efficient.

Here’s one weird trick that will break the Internet.

In macOS, if you highlight text, you can then paste it using Shift + Command + “v”.

Kind of like X Windows middle button.

Re: Mac's command key is worse than Window's ctrl

#18

Post by eager_noob »

lesserknowndan wrote: post #17
bediger4000 wrote: post #12

What I can't get used to is no mouse button paste in either MacOS or Windows. The X11 all-mouse copy-n-paste is so much more efficient.

Here’s one weird trick that will break the Internet. In macOS, if you highlight text, you can then paste it using Shift + Command + “v”. Kind of like X Windows middle button.

Is this copy/paste with highlight available globally or limited only to terminals?

I can do this with text highlighted in iterm. Highlighted text can be copied in other apps as well with Shift + Command + “v”. Or with terminal app, where the shortcut only works when used within terminal app itself.

Re: Mac's command key is worse than Window's ctrl

#19

Post by vapemaster »

jrjsmrtn wrote: post #8
jrjsmrtn wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try Cmd-w (close), Cmd-X (Cut), Cmd-C (Copy), Cmd-V (Paste), Cmd-Z (Undo), Cmd-A (Select All), Cmd-Q (Quit) with your left thumb on Command and the left index on the other key. Try Cmd-P (Print), Cmd-, (Preferences) with your left thumb and a right finger. I'm using macOS and Windows since the 80s, Gnome and KDE later; I still think that Windows and Linux are generations away from macOS consistency and ergonomic...

Moreover: on macOS Cmd [-Option][-Shift][-Ctrl]- is always about a menu item/command shortcut; [Option][-Shift][-Ctrl]- is always about a glyph.

well [ctrl] + are used for window management by default

Re: Mac's command key is worse than Window's ctrl

#20

Post by vapemaster »

greazy wrote: post #14
dekhn wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

but with the thumb on command, you have to contort your fingers to hit any of the alphabet keys.

I agree you still have to contort your hand but it is significantly less movement than using your pinky. IMO you should remap your keys: https://karabiner-elements.pqrs.org/ Every system will not be 100% to your liking, so make it work for you.

I immediately had to get Karibiner to at least give me my home and end keys back on a external keyboard.

I've been to aggressively remapping that I don't then create a similar problem when using another machine I don't own but maybe I'll give in and go the more custom route

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