Earlier quoted context omitted.
For the most part, my personal experience matches yours, but this is a pretty myopic way of looking at the article. I have great friends that are wonderful and amazingly supportive, but there is something just...different about the church community I grew up in. Take the example of the truly unfortunate disaster, for example as another commenter mentioned, complications with the birth of a 3rd or 4th child. A "good"…
I can see that might be appealing to some, but it still doesn't really appeal to me. I'm not sure I'd want a wider community of people I hardly know to rally around me like that. Perhaps I just haven't been in a bad enough situation, perhaps I do trust my friends and family that much, perhaps I'm just more insular than that. I don't know.
The World Needs a Secular Community Revolution
101–110 of 183 posts
Re: The World Needs a Secular Community Revolution
#102Earlier quoted context omitted.
I just ran into a Independent Order of Odd Fellow lodge a couple weeks ago, while visiting a new city (Decorah, IA). I thought: what the hell is that? A little googling revealed the underlying ethos of the organization to be highly attractive, but from what I can glean from the website the whole thing seems to have fallen into decay. Pity. The 'pushback against big business' angle was news to me, though. Interesting…
"The 'pushback against big business' angle was news to me, though. Interesting perspective. Any references you could recommend to dig into that aspect?" This history of the Texas Railroad Commission may be helpful.[1] [1] https://www.tsl.texas.gov/exhibits/railroad/fight/page2.html
Re: The World Needs a Secular Community Revolution
#103The US used to have that. You can still see the remnants if you look. Rotary International, Kiwanis International, the Independent Order of Foresters, the Veterans of Foreign Wars, the Independent Order of Odd Fellows, the National Grange of the Order of Patrons of Husbandry - all those secular fraternal organizations still exist. The core of these organizations was small business owners, a group which once ran their…
http://www.waymarking.com/waymarks/WM5WBJ_The_Four_Way_Corner_San_Francisco_CARe: The World Needs a Secular Community Revolution
#104Re: The World Needs a Secular Community Revolution
#105The US used to have that. You can still see the remnants if you look. Rotary International, Kiwanis International, the Independent Order of Foresters, the Veterans of Foreign Wars, the Independent Order of Odd Fellows, the National Grange of the Order of Patrons of Husbandry - all those secular fraternal organizations still exist. The core of these organizations was small business owners, a group which once ran their…
Does anyone know of any younger, modern versions of these institutions?
Re: The World Needs a Secular Community Revolution
#106On the other hand, if the religious communities seem to be more fit enough that they are worth emulating, maybe that says something about evolution.
Disclaimer: I find evolution completely unpersuasive. The article just seems weird, like maybe the author has discovered a flaw in evolution without realizing it, but I can't quite describe why I find it weird.
Re: The World Needs a Secular Community Revolution
#107I'm intrigued that he suggests secular communities should "put fellowship first" and "appeal to all kinds of people" in order to do so, when the traditional religious communities that he says succeed don't set out to do those things.
In a functional Christian church (and granted, many US churches are not), the community's shared goal is to love and serve God and the people around them.
The community, and any appeal it has, are side effects.
This shared goal comes straight from the Bible. If you read the whole thing, you'll find the theme appears throughout, but Jesus espouses it very clearly in Matthew: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%2022:36...
As a Christian who grew up in the church, and has watched various Christian communities function (and sometimes dysfunction), I think this belief, at the very core of Christianity, is exactly what makes many churches wonderful communities.
Each member of the church believes that the crafter of particle physics, the shaper of Mount Everest, the painter of the auroras, loves them so intensely that he took on human form and died to save them from the worst decisions they have made, the betrayals that devastated their friends, family, themselves, and him.
You may think that belief is ludicrous, and that we are naive, irrational fools for holding it.
Even so, it should be clear that those who believe it would feel compelled to follow that example, as much as they can. Caring for others that well is nigh-impossible, but it's the unattainable standard a church strives for.
Many churches have long forgotten what they once believed. Even when it's remembered, humans remain frail as ever. It is not easy to put others before yourself even when you like them, let alone when they belittle and insult you.
When it works, though, it's amazing to see.
I think that's why few secular communities or institutions have outlasted the Christian church. Right or wrong, the Christian vision has caring for others as an essential imperative.
That seems to me to be the very essence of a community.
I may be blinded by my bias, but I don't see how an explicitly secular organization could have as rich a community.
It cannot point to the perfect exemplar of their ideals and say "This is how you should strive to be." It cannot say "The earth and its works will be unmade and remade, but the communities you forge now will live into eternity."
"If we don't make better communities, we'll be sadder before we die" just doesn't seem as compelling.
Re: The World Needs a Secular Community Revolution
#108Earlier quoted context omitted.
If you join a fundamentalist cult, then yes. Lots of modern churches are non-denominational and quite relaxed. In fact, they are surprisingly similar to the entity being described in the article.
I'm pretty sure a belief in the major parts of the bible are necessary, are they not? I mean, I thought the resurrection of christ was the whole point of anything describable as Christianity? Without that, well is that 'church' ?
Re: The World Needs a Secular Community Revolution
#109Earlier quoted context omitted.
If you join a fundamentalist cult, then yes. Lots of modern churches are non-denominational and quite relaxed. In fact, they are surprisingly similar to the entity being described in the article.
I'm pretty sure a belief in the major parts of the bible are necessary, are they not? I mean, I thought the resurrection of christ was the whole point of anything describable as Christianity? Without that, well is that 'church' ?
Yes: "But if it is preached that Christ has been raised from the dead, how can some of you say that there is no resurrection of the dead? If there is no resurrection of the dead, then not even Christ has been raised. And if Christ has not been raised, our preaching is useless and so is your faith." 1 Corinthians 15:12-14
Re: The World Needs a Secular Community Revolution
#110Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think what makes most religions so inflexible is having a canon which can be difficult to circumvent. If a secular order is based on the opinions of the founders who are treated as wise humans instead of divine, it becomes easier to accept that they could be wrong or just misinformed.
I'm sadly skeptical, given how much weight Americans seem to give to the intentions of the founding fathers when it comes to discussing the constitution.