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Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

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Re: Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

#81
post #46
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What if it's the other way around? What if the smart and passionate folks at Facebook really do just want to get the internet to the rest of the world, and this is the way they can justify doing so? They are a public company, after all. They have to fulfill their fiduciary responsibilities to shareholders, or at least appear to do so...

The fact that going public always tends to make a company's contributions to society less altruistic and turn the ethos of the company into "moar profitz foar de shaerhoaldurs" raises some fairly damning questions about our capital system and its tendency towards greed and stagnation.

Is this really the fault of the financial system? In some respects I believe 'economics' is a verb, so the fault -if there is any- lies with the agents enacting the verb, that is to say: people. Humans, groups of them even, certainly have a tendency to produce and accumulate all sorts of things being their survival needs and go on to trade them. This raises all sorts of concerns and has cause many a lot of stress.

Blaming 'capital' seems fairly erroneous. Deirdre Mccloskey, in her book 'Bourgeois Dignity: Why Economics Can't Explain the Modern World' has a very convincing go at turning the idea into a fallacy. The accumulation and use of capital isn't, in and of itself, a bad thing. How much good has come from our desire to pool resources.

Also, it seems to me we tend to forget what the word 'corporation' means, literally "any group of persons united or regarded as united in one body". Certainly the other more obvious definition of the word includes that thing about "having a continuous existence independent of the existences of its members", though me must remember that the words "an association of individuals, created by law or under authority of law" come immediately prior. If people lose faith in a "company" it will rapidly cease to exist, or at the very lease must drastically change in order to continue.

And yes, I acknowledge we are, probably to a greater extend than we typically realise, products of our environment, products of the societal structures, and built environs, we find ourselves in, and that this makes it very messy to try to discern cause and effect, and to apportion blame. I guess I'm just sceptical of apportioning blame, I don't believe it's particularly helpful.

Maybe this comment is a bit incoherent. I often find myself writing comments then not posting them because I can't seem to make a point without contradicting, or undermining, my own writing.

Maybe my point is that things probably aren't as simple, as clear cut, as we think. Maybe that's why some people study the liberal arts and sciences and go on to write entire volumes on these sorts of topics.

Re: Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

#82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some internet > no internet

That isn't true. One of the reasons why France tends to be a bit behind in all things internet even today is that they had 'minitel', a system that wasn't quite the whole internet (it was information services reachable by phone using a custom terminal with the prestel protocol). It worked so well that they didn't replace their system with the internet when it became available and as a result have been playing catch-u…

Well said. So what are we do to? Not that I necessarily feel motivated to do anything myself, fairly comfortable being an keyboard-warrior and all.

What prevents someone(s) from launching a competing service? Some of the answers to that are obvious, given what you've written.

What are we to do?

Re: Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

#83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Facebook is a business, yes. Does that mean they do not positively impact the world? Absolutely not. IIRC they are providing FB and Wikipedia (among other resources), those two resources alone will allow people the access to the entirety of human knowledge, and the ability to connect to anyone in the world. Via there phone. That is _huge_. Yes, it isn't perfect, and yes FB is investing for advertising in ~5-10+ years…

> ... will allow people to access the entirety of human knowledge ... This is so far removed from the truth. What about blogs? Academic papers? Journalistic articles? Mailing list threads? Even paper books! The name "Internet.org" is grossly misleading. "Who controls the past controls the future; who controls the present controls the past." Willingly giving a service effective control of the present yields dastardly…

My claim was not correct. However, a lot of blogs, journals, books etc. are used as references for Wikipedia. Regardless, this is a huge step up. We must not let perfection get in the way of progress. FB will not have any control, people can choose to use it, or not. They are also free to pay for an ISP when an affordable and reliable one arrives. Which at this point is not possible.

Re: Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

#84
post #69

I believe that as facebook gains the territory, so does Instagram, messenger, WhatsApp, and every other acquired product. So the plan isn't really to just deliver internet service but to buy up the social world in the area without competitors. Since about 1.49 billion of the 1/3 of the internet enabled regions use one of Facebook products even with the competitions, it's evident that this project would triple their i…

[deleted]

Re: Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

#85
Why are people on HN actually supporting this? Facebook built a plane to beam its horrible timesink to even more people. Facebook is not a good thing. No company "gives things away" out of the good of their heart. They built a PLANE. Honestly, the only word I can describe this with is: scary.

Re: Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

#86
post #64

So Facebook is the new AOL/Compuserve in some places. Did AOL die because people prefer the full open Internet, or did AOL die because it was too limited? Either way, history will likely repeat itself. Are people on this thread really worried that as things develop, people won't want to reach outside of the wall garden eventually? I think they will naturally.

You're probably right. It'll be interesting to see what sort of protocol tunnelling people create. IOFM - Internet Over Facebook Messenger and such.

Re: Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

#87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some internet > no internet

That isn't true. One of the reasons why France tends to be a bit behind in all things internet even today is that they had 'minitel', a system that wasn't quite the whole internet (it was information services reachable by phone using a custom terminal with the prestel protocol). It worked so well that they didn't replace their system with the internet when it became available and as a result have been playing catch-u…

I disagree that minitel itself played any significant role in France's current situation. It was the French governments inability to get out of the way. Minitel was also in the U.S. in the early 90s, but didn't last because competition wasn't outlawed. This is a substantial step up to the current alternative. No one is being 'locked' in, this will increase education and communication, and therefore the welfare of the users. Than, ISPs will come in and wipe them out. You have to start somewhere.

Re: Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

#88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That isn't true. One of the reasons why France tends to be a bit behind in all things internet even today is that they had 'minitel', a system that wasn't quite the whole internet (it was information services reachable by phone using a custom terminal with the prestel protocol). It worked so well that they didn't replace their system with the internet when it became available and as a result have been playing catch-u…

I disagree that minitel itself played any significant role in France's current situation. It was the French governments inability to get out of the way. Minitel was also in the U.S. in the early 90s, but didn't last because competition wasn't outlawed. This is a substantial step up to the current alternative. No one is being 'locked' in, this will increase education and communication, and therefore the welfare of the…

> It was the French governments inability to get out of the way.

That's because FT had the government as their shareholder and they were trying to protect their investment. That's definitely another important factor but the fact that minitel actually worked was definitely a detriment.

I remember visiting France during the Internet boom in the rest of Europe and people there were proudly showing off their minitel terminals (tiny little screens with a slide-out keyboard) and what they could do with it and how they didn't need this newfangled American nonsense in their houses.

Of course that didn't hold in the longer term but it certainly did not help early adoption.

Re: Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

#89
post #74
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, that still looks pretty good, because some people want to buy Coca Cola.

They might also want to buy, I don't know, bread . Should the bread company have to build their own roads, too? That's a better world, how exactly? And what about the people who don't want to buy Coca Cola? Should they get to buy nothing ?

But those roads were already nonexistent, and their nonexistence is not affected by the existence of Coca Cola roads. In this hypothetical, we are comparing a world with no roads to a world with roads to deliver Coca Cola. Since some people like Coca Cola, I find the latter world preferable.

Re: Facebook completes construction of first full-scale aircraft, Aquila [video]

#90
post #57
post #2

Planes that fly for 3 months at a time on sunlight, bringing the Internet to people isn't cool?

I would like to now why 3 months. Do they need to change batteries?

Scheduled maintenance, I suspect. Inspect and maintain rather than wait till it falls out of the sky.
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