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I noticed some disturbing privacy defaults in Windows 10

jonathan.porta.codes

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Re: I noticed some disturbing privacy defaults in Windows 10

#391

Post by leeleelee »

May I ask...to those who are so deeply opposed to sharing your personal data with corporations and their partners:

Let's assume, worst case scenario -- you enable every single data sharing option on your Android phone as well as let's say, Windows desktop. And you use chrome browser, logged in, etc. All the time.

Now, the question is: explain to me, what you expect to be the negative outcome and how it affects your daily life.

I am genuinely curious. Or is this just a fear of the unknown and projecting into the future all of the bad things that may happen (or also may not)?

Re: I noticed some disturbing privacy defaults in Windows 10

#392

Post by v0x »

phjesusthatguy3 wrote: post #182
MichaelGG wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah there should definitely be a "Hey Cortana, off the record,..." query mode. I'm a bit conflicted now. My girls are 7 & 9 and they've been using Microsoft Accounts. With the final Win10 build having all this (none of these settings worked a few months ago), it looks like I've got a lot of reading and explaining to do for them.

If you don't have any Windows-only applications keeping your younger-than-double-digit children on Windows, well then now is your chance to put them on anything-other-than-Windows. My own children are still using computers with Windows 7. They play Spore (Windows only), Sims 3 (Windows only) Minecraft (Java, so playable anywhere), Osu! (no idea, really), and a couple of other games. I have no intention of upgrading W…

I still think Win2k was a great operating system and I wish I could go back to it, but you do eventually have to upgrade. I eventually had to upgrade Win2k to Win7 because of the many performance benefits and the lack of support for the OS.

Even though I personally hate literally almost every new feature of Windows 10 and the design of the entire OS, I'm still running it, simply because I get much better performance out of it than I do on Win7 - and I can generally customize my UX.

Re: I noticed some disturbing privacy defaults in Windows 10

#393

Post by briandear »

moron4hire wrote: post #46

This looks like all the same sort of stuff Google defaults you into on Android. I mean, not that it's any better because of that, but this is the state of things now. You're not going to find better unless you install FOSS. Unless you're ready to go full-in on one of the BSDs or a Linux-that-isn't-Ubuntu, navigating the waters of figuring out how to get a phone that has all the features you want with such an OS, figu…

One big advantage I get from my Mac OS over FOSS solutions is that they have an incentive to constantly improve their product. Do you know a single professional designer using a FOSS Illustrator? How about the FOSS version of Keynote? Or the FOSS version of Final Cut and Logic? FOSS isn't the answer to every question. FOSS is like a city bus; reliable enough, cheap enough for everyone and goes mostly where you want to go despite the occasional smell or sleeping vagrant sprawled across the seats. However, it certainly doesn't compare to driving your own Mercedes.

FOSS is certainly great, but it isn't the end all be all, despite utopian hippie delusions to the contrary.

Re: I noticed some disturbing privacy defaults in Windows 10

#394

Post by Silhouette »

bpodgursky wrote: post #251
quadrangle wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do not consent to you and others giving Microsoft (or Google or Facebook etc…) all the personal information this necessarily reveals about me when you accept their terms and have any electronic interactions with me.

That's not your consent to give. If you tell me your name, I'm free to repeat that to whoever I want. If you aren't ok with public information being re-broadcasted, don't go outside.

If you aren't ok with public information being re-broadcasted, don't go outside.

Rights and freedoms that you can only exercise by giving up any semblance of normal life are no rights and freedoms at all. The idea that the moment you step outside of your home or go on-line you forfeit any right to the slightest respect for your privacy and we should just accept this is silly.

And if you think the only people who care are a few internet warriors, please consider the likes of Google's Glass and Street View, where some people have felt strongly enough about the invasions to resort to actual criminal violence in response, and some entire countries have clamped down on the surveillance in response to public concerns.

In any case, with many of these systems, we aren't talking about public information. We're talking about technologies that systematically abuse friendships and commercial relationships by getting one party to tell the technology operators information about another party without that other party's knowledge or consent and potentially even if that information had been given in confidence.

Re: I noticed some disturbing privacy defaults in Windows 10

#395

Post by Silhouette »

cbd1984 wrote: post #348
freehunter wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Who wanted that for desktop computers or laptops? I did. Linux and OSX are still available for whoever wants them. You can stick with Windows 7 if you want, that's just fine. I like Cortana. I like my software knowing what I like and what I'm interested in. It makes my life easier, which is what computers were invented for. I can see why some people might not, and to be fair I use Linux on my work laptop because the…

> You can stick with Windows 7 if you want Not indefinitely. It will get EOL'ed, and at that point it might not be possible to opt-out of the upgrade. Which isn't bad given that MS isn't going to keep supporting W7 forever: It's a genuinely bad thing to have unpatched OSes with known security holes (zero-decade, I suppose?) out in the hands of non-technical users. That kind of thing was moderately acceptable when Ave…

Not indefinitely. It will get EOL'ed, and at that point it might not be possible to opt-out of the upgrade.

It's always possible to opt out of the upgrade with Windows 7. I have a perpetual licence to use it, and I can turn off any automatic updates that would break it.

The worst that will happen, short of Microsoft as a business going under or similarly dramatic changes, is that I will only enjoy free security updates from Microsoft until the end of the guaranteed support period (still several years away) and then I will have to use alternative means to secure my systems against any remaining threats.

As demonstrated by the large organisations still on XP, one of those means may simply be paying more money to Microsoft to continue supporting an older platform you want to keep using.

Re: I noticed some disturbing privacy defaults in Windows 10

#396

Post by TimFogarty »

ewzimm wrote: post #20

Windows is now essentially a personalized, cloud-based operating system with the primary interface as a personal assistant, so I expected to see all these things as defaults. The advanced features just couldn't work without it. I'm glad there's at least an opt-out, but I do think that Windows needs an OS-wide incognito mode, just a simple switch to record or not record data. I generally use that on my browser for whe…

> I do think that Windows needs an OS-wide incognito mode, just a simple switch to record or not record data.

Sounds like switching to a guest account. Not as quick as a simple "toggle data recording" button, but that functionality is definitely already in Windows.

Re: I noticed some disturbing privacy defaults in Windows 10

#397

Post by userbinator »

theg2 wrote: post #21
graycat wrote: post #8

Okay. Good to know. So, when I decide to upgrade from Windows XP, I will install the legal DVD I have of Windows 7 and stay with that for years! No Windows 8, 10, etc. for me until Microsoft makes some fantastically strong and solid statements about compatibility with old software, security, and privacy.

Worried about security and privacy...yet still uses Windows XP?

Are people actually believing Microsoft's FUD?

The "security" of newer Windows is mostly anti-user, anti-freedom. XP doesn't enforce code signing, and SFP is only advisory, so you can run whatever you want, hack and customise the OS code easily to get it to behave how you want. Most of the exploits that gave XP a bad name in the early days were from IE in its default configuration, which basically no one on XP will be using now.

It takes time to get bugs get discovered and fixed. There's a lot of new code in these newer versions and I bet they'll be uncovering more bugs in it as time goes on, some of which won't be applicable to XP because the code isn't even present.

As for "privacy"... XP most certainly does not phone home with anywhere near the amount of info that Win10 collects, as this article shows.

I'd be more inclined to say "Worried about security and privacy...but still wants to upgrade to Windows 10?"

My next jump after XP will likely be some form of Linux with WINE - with everything that can phone home removed.

Re: I noticed some disturbing privacy defaults in Windows 10

#398

Post by Silhouette »

ManFromUranus wrote: post #279
batou wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely no one wanted it. No one asked for it. We were spun a load of marketing disguised as listening and attention. This turned out to be exactly what Microsoft wanted which was another aggressive move against customers both business and consumer. Despite all this the noise and confusion and dubious love for the products is shining out of the arses of every non technical news source. What did we expect? I've lef…

You were always free to not use new MS operating systems. Nobody forced you to make any MS accounts or use Window 8,10 or whatever, so if you installed Windows 8 and didn't like it, that doesn't make MS evil, just don't use it. Anyone who inclined to use CentOS as their daily driver probably was never going to like MS OS's anyway. You probably only ever installed it just to find out what you hate about it.

You were always free to not use new MS operating systems.

Are you also free not to have your private information (personal data, trade secrets, whatever it might be) given to Microsoft by others you interact with who do use Microsoft's new operating systems?

Re: I noticed some disturbing privacy defaults in Windows 10

#399

Post by userbinator »

cbd1984 wrote: post #348
freehunter wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Who wanted that for desktop computers or laptops? I did. Linux and OSX are still available for whoever wants them. You can stick with Windows 7 if you want, that's just fine. I like Cortana. I like my software knowing what I like and what I'm interested in. It makes my life easier, which is what computers were invented for. I can see why some people might not, and to be fair I use Linux on my work laptop because the…

> You can stick with Windows 7 if you want Not indefinitely. It will get EOL'ed, and at that point it might not be possible to opt-out of the upgrade. Which isn't bad given that MS isn't going to keep supporting W7 forever: It's a genuinely bad thing to have unpatched OSes with known security holes (zero-decade, I suppose?) out in the hands of non-technical users. That kind of thing was moderately acceptable when Ave…

a genuinely bad thing to have unpatched OSes with known security holes

If the OS is popular enough, once they get known, they will be fixed by the community if not MS. Look up "Windows 98SE Unofficial Service Pack" and "KernelEx". In fact the 98SE community is still very much alive... and has added support for a lot of things that MS didn't.

Gradually, I predict the same will happen with XP, and possibly 7 when MS stops supporting it.

Re: I noticed some disturbing privacy defaults in Windows 10

#400

Post by userbinator »

freehunter wrote: post #193
Animats wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Windows is now essentially a personalized, cloud-based operating system with the primary interface as a personal assistant." Who wanted that for desktop computers or laptops? This is not going to fly with business customers. Microsoft has already bombed twice in the business space, with Windows Vista and Windows 8. This looks like another bomb. Windows 7 is still pretty good, and it will probably be the main Microso…

>Who wanted that for desktop computers or laptops? I did. Linux and OSX are still available for whoever wants them. You can stick with Windows 7 if you want, that's just fine. I like Cortana. I like my software knowing what I like and what I'm interested in. It makes my life easier, which is what computers were invented for. I can see why some people might not, and to be fair I use Linux on my work laptop because the…

I like my software knowing what I like and what I'm interested in. It makes my life easier, which is what computers were invented for.

Philosophical question: is it really your life, if your software may be subtly persuading you in a different direction than what you would've taken if it hadn't been making the suggestions to influence you?

There is no doubt it will make things easier for you if all you do is effectively accept and follow everything others want you to with no resistance. However, that's not what I'd consider "your life" anymore.

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