Homejoy says goodbye • Hacker News Board

Re: Homejoy says goodbye

#301

Post by zecho » Fri, Jul 17, 2015, 7:50 PM UTC

jasonwilk wrote: post #129

I wanted HomeJoy to work and tried to use the service a few times. What the failure came down to: 1. The cleaners were not professionals. It felt like they were just recruiting anyone who wanted a job. You could really feel this with the lack of passion from the cleaners and the severe lack of quality cleaning. Most of the people complained and were quite rude sometimes. Cleaning is very much a skill as much as it is…

> 1. The cleaners were not professionals. It felt like they were just recruiting anyone who wanted a job. You could really feel this with the lack of passion from the cleaners and the severe lack of quality cleaning. Most of the people complained and were quite rude sometimes. Cleaning is very much a skill as much as it is manual labor.

Maybe their passion wasn't cleaning your house for you and they just wanted some money to pursue real passions.

Re: Homejoy says goodbye

#302

Post by jeremyt » Fri, Jul 17, 2015, 7:50 PM UTC

mbesto wrote: post #193

As tptacek said, I'm sure many of the people who created and work for these businesses are well intended and hard working, and we have to applaud them for that. However, the writing is on the wall for any "sharing economy" service that is simply a technology wrapper for non-SSN'd workers in the US. A couple of challenges that aren't solved by technology: 1. Many unskilled labor positions, especially those that incorp…

Cofounder of thumbtack here. I think you misunderstand our business model. We don't hire anybody; we're just a marketplace. A request comes in, we connect it with qualified professionals, and then they bid directly on the job.

At no time have we gone out and hired "MBA students or aspiring actors" to fill our provider directory. From day one all of our providers were actually working in their industry prior to signing up with us.

Further, I would say that we don't have the same quality problem that Homejoy does. If you submit a request on our site, you'll get a choice between several providers at different price points and quality points. You choose the provider. Poor providers will get low ratings and will either have to lower their prices or exit the system.

Re: Homejoy says goodbye

#303

Post by warfangle » Fri, Jul 17, 2015, 7:55 PM UTC

_ea1k wrote: post #209

austenallred wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disregarding the competitive aspect, it's absurd to me that people praise banning Uber and Tesla for the "consumer safety" of taxis and car dealerships.

There is a significant consumer safety element to the way Taxis are regulated. The fact that this is used to protect a monopoly is a separate issue and I agree that it is a real problem. The Tesla analogy is perfect, though. I've never felt like car dealerships being independently owned was a useful benefit. I don't see any reason why both models can't coexist.

> I've never felt like car dealerships being independently owned was a useful benefit

Eh, it was useful for car manufacturers when they were first getting going: they didn't have to put up the capital to open shop. The regulation came in when a dealership showed that a given region had high demand for the company's cars, so the company would move in across the street and undercut the franchised dealer. Obviously the franchised dealer had more clout with local politics than the auto manufacturer did - this is why all the dealership laws are state laws. It was kind of a legitimate regulation back /then/, but really has no bearing on things now (especially for a car company that has never franchised any dealers).

Re: Homejoy says goodbye

#304

Post by danielweber » Fri, Jul 17, 2015, 7:57 PM UTC

zaidf wrote: post #277

jclune wrote: post #268

I run a company similar to HomeJoy in Japan, and I disagree with most comments here. 1. Those who claim cleaning is not a "skilled job" should get off their keyboard, spend a day cleaning their moms house, and get back to me when they learn they are 3X slower than a pro and destroyed something with bleach-based spray. 2. It feels like nobody here actually read Adora Cheung's quotes about multiple lawsuits coinciding…

1. Those who claim cleaning is not a "skilled job" should get off their keyboard, spend a day cleaning their moms house, and get back to me when they learn they are 3X slower than a pro and destroyed something with bleach-based spray. x100. There is a lot more variance between two cleaners than say two Uber drivers.

On the 428 day old HN thread, it looks like lots of people had problems with lack of quality

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7750433

Re: Homejoy says goodbye

#305

Post by danielweber » Fri, Jul 17, 2015, 8:01 PM UTC

icelancer wrote: post #15

fraXis wrote: post #7

I used Homejoy and I liked it's ease of use. But after the cleaning lady they sent me was done, she offered me her direct phone # and told me I could contact her directly for any future cleaning needs. I always wondered how this business model was going to work if Homejoy's contractors could just give out their phone # at the end of their first service and the customer could just contact them directly for any future…

Going through Homejoy instead of direct offers you Homejoy's bonded protection and insurance, plus refund platform. This is worth something.

Protection and insurance are most valuable the first time I hire someone, in case they are a nutcase or thief.

Re: Homejoy says goodbye

#306

Post by mycroft-holmes » Fri, Jul 17, 2015, 8:01 PM UTC

thatusertwo wrote: post #287

mycroft-holmes wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The real question to ask in this case is whether those regulations should be there in the first place.

Regulations exist for a reason, some maybe old or irrelevant but they all evolved in response to the industries they regulate.

There's a such thing as regulatory capture.

Re: Homejoy says goodbye

#307

Post by michaelt » Fri, Jul 17, 2015, 8:01 PM UTC

x0x0 wrote: post #225

jonknee wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People can take pride in all sorts of work.

Yeah, but complaining their cleaner wasn't "passionate" mostly comes off as being pissy your poorly-paid short-term menial labor didn't fluff your ego enough for being so awesome to pay him or her. You can do a perfectly good job cleaning without pretending you're so passionate about cleaning you'd just love to do it for free! (I have similar complaints about development jobs, btw -- you can do a perfectly good job a…

A lot of jobs involve what sociologists call "emotional labor" - jobs where, to be an effective worker, you can't always show your first-choice emotions.

If I'm at a table service restaurant and my waiter is visibly unhappy about having to bring us food and drinks, I don't want to be an asshole by keeping on making him do that. I'd rather cook my own food at home next time. But a table service restaurant where waiters aren't bringing customers food and drink is going to go out of business pretty soon.

That's why waiters are trained to engage in emotional labor - in saying "of course sir, it's no problem" when they'd rather sigh or complain; the emotional labor is actually an important part of the job.

Personally I've never hired a cleaner because I'd feel like an asshole asking some poor stranger to scrub my toilet. But if I did hire a cleaner, and they came around and left me feeling that yes, I am an asshole for hiring them to scrub my toilet, I probably wouldn't hire a cleaner again. If you're running a cleaning company, that's not good for business.

Re: Homejoy says goodbye

#308

Post by Lawtonfogle » Fri, Jul 17, 2015, 8:03 PM UTC

zaidf wrote: post #277

jclune wrote: post #268

I run a company similar to HomeJoy in Japan, and I disagree with most comments here. 1. Those who claim cleaning is not a "skilled job" should get off their keyboard, spend a day cleaning their moms house, and get back to me when they learn they are 3X slower than a pro and destroyed something with bleach-based spray. 2. It feels like nobody here actually read Adora Cheung's quotes about multiple lawsuits coinciding…

1. Those who claim cleaning is not a "skilled job" should get off their keyboard, spend a day cleaning their moms house, and get back to me when they learn they are 3X slower than a pro and destroyed something with bleach-based spray. x100. There is a lot more variance between two cleaners than say two Uber drivers.

Due to the regulations needed to drive. Put someone with no experience driving behind a wheel and you'll quickly see how skill based driving is. Just, unlike good cleaning, we have a lot of training and experience with good driving.

Or if this is too extreme of an example, look at what happens when you give a driver who has only driven small cars a big truck pulling a loaded trailer. They'll definitely be slower than the driver's with skill.

Re: Homejoy says goodbye

#309

Post by myohan » Fri, Jul 17, 2015, 8:07 PM UTC

They were also sued. http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2015/03/startup-workers-s...

Re: Homejoy says goodbye

#310

Post by Simulacra » Fri, Jul 17, 2015, 8:08 PM UTC

I thought HomeJoy was an awesome idea at first, until I started reading about the experiences, and tribulations, of their ...contractors? Not even sure what to call them, other than hardworking people who, when you balance it all out, weren't making that much. I'm sure the CEO and her brother made a killing, but house cleaning is tough work, even for people who do it professionally every day, for a living. I think those people should be employees, they should be given job protections, and they should be treated (and paid) a lot better than they are.