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The Lonely End: in aging Japan, thousands die alone and unnoticed

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Re: The Lonely End: in aging Japan, thousands die alone and unnoticed

#141

Post by protomyth »

white-flame wrote: post #84
smil wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How has your country (you must be American) distinguished itself by doing these same core social and psychological issues? Or are Americans stubborn and ignorant?

America is home to thousands if not millions of volunteer groups, social change movements, debates and university studies on these sorts of situations. There isn't any sort of central government ministry dealing with stuff like this, but large independent swathes of society do try to work to establish where these problems come from, and how best to deal with them. If anything, Americans would suffer more from fatigue…

In part of the USA, the tradition of churches tending to the flock is still going strong. Also, the local gathering place where folks swap news and talk (the bakery in the small town I'm in) is still a fixture.

Re: The Lonely End: in aging Japan, thousands die alone and unnoticed

#142

Post by protomyth »

gcv wrote: post #132
A_COMPUTER wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shikata_ga_nai

English has an equivalent: "it is what it is". It also stops solution-seeking dead in its tracks. A hateful little phrase.

That's educational. Had a boss who normally on an even keel then someone said "it is what it is" to him and he got very, very angry. It was like someone kicked him. He said that was just unacceptable and we would find a solution / work around. I guess I now know the other half of the story.

Re: The Lonely End: in aging Japan, thousands die alone and unnoticed

#143

Post by robocat »

branchless wrote: post #128
Tistel wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Me too. I live in a city far from where I grew up. Good job. Lots of money. Don't know a soul.

Do something like go joint meetup.com. If you job isn't something like brain surgeon or another essential item then it's the old adage: nobody ever wished they had spent more time at work on their death bed.

> go joint meetup.com

Not really a fan of that advice (although better than no action) - I believe it is difficult to avoid shallow connections with a shifting group of people.

I personally (A) choose to share accommodation (shared house), (B) live in a part of the city that has that community feel (not the "best" neighborhood). Now meaningful long-term connections just happen without trying (in fact it would take effort to avoid it).

Re: The Lonely End: in aging Japan, thousands die alone and unnoticed

#144

Post by goldfeld »

contergan wrote: post #112
keithpeter wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Japan is incredibly stubborn and ignorant when it comes to addressing core social and psychological problems in their society." Not just Japan http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-33... Politicians in the UK talk about community this and community that but in practice we are losing the ties between neighbours/families.

Well, what do you expect? Multiculturalism and a strong sense of community don't really go together very well.

When bigots run the place and "community" more often than not stands for segregative christian values, they really don't.

Re: The Lonely End: in aging Japan, thousands die alone and unnoticed

#145

Post by SolaceQuantum »

unabst wrote: post #130
JesperRavn wrote: post #34

Why are there so many stories HN on social problems in Asia? I would have expected that smart people on HN would make some effort to understand Orientalism[0]. In the case of this story, this is a phenomenon that is occurring all around the developed world. Japan is in many ways just another developed country. But through the eyes of Orientalism, Japan's problems are unique and quaint, and the objective Westerner can…

There certainly are cases of orientalist depiction in journalism, but I don't feel that is the case here. It could simply be the case that the volume of their social debate is loud enough that it is being picked up by other countries, because, as you say, it is a common problem. As it turns out, senior isolation is at 28% in the US vs 20% in Japan. In the US, we don't even talk about it. To me, that is a far more ser…

I would argue that it's not because the volume of the social debate is louder in Japan than the states. It's because of a tendency to see another country's problems from outside the country allows journalism articles like this.

I'm sure there are plenty of articles in other countries talking about how Americans are having an elderly crisis that no one is talking about, as well. Certain things like leaving your elderly in a retirement home away from the family are downright unthinkable. My parents (Chinese, I'm a 1st gen Chinese American) have told me they don't want me to treat them like the Americans treat their parents (e.g. putting your grandma in a nursing home to rot alone). I'm sure they get this from their own Chinese media sources.

Re: The Lonely End: in aging Japan, thousands die alone and unnoticed

#146

Post by tsotha »

Johnythree wrote: post #101
tsotha wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Disgusting and ignorant"? Because I don't share your religion? That's pretty narrow minded.

What??? Your religion claims that the universe is here just for mankind's benefit? You really believe that? This planet was here for millions of years before mankind came along, and hopefully will be here for millions afterwards.

My religion? What religion is that?

Who cares how long the planet was here before humans? The planet isn't going anywhere no matter what we do.

Re: The Lonely End: in aging Japan, thousands die alone and unnoticed

#147

Post by keithpeter »

deckiedan wrote: post #138
contergan wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, what do you expect? Multiculturalism and a strong sense of community don't really go together very well.

I really strongly disagree with the sentiment of this comment. I've been living and working in a very ethnically / culturally diverse non-profit charity organisation for several years now. We're a Christian charity, so there are strong religious ties across the board, but huge cultural differences. A sense of community is far more developed by the shared experiences together , rather than just the similarity of past…

"Very mono-cultural, very white, working class, etc. There's really not a lot of sense of community at all."

My experience also in multi-ethnic Birmingham. I think shared experience is the key.

Re: The Lonely End: in aging Japan, thousands die alone and unnoticed

#148

Post by reagency »

sliverstorm wrote: post #59
impendia wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I lived in Japan for two years, and studied the language, and it was amazing how that sentence always brought any discussion to a conclusion. Grammatically, its negation would be "Shikata ga aru", but I never heard this said once.

Sounds like it's a thought-terminating cliche- of which we have many in English.

"It's God's will."

Re: The Lonely End: in aging Japan, thousands die alone and unnoticed

#149

Post by [deleted] »

sliverstorm wrote: post #59
impendia wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I lived in Japan for two years, and studied the language, and it was amazing how that sentence always brought any discussion to a conclusion. Grammatically, its negation would be "Shikata ga aru", but I never heard this said once.

Sounds like it's a thought-terminating cliche- of which we have many in English.

[deleted]

Re: The Lonely End: in aging Japan, thousands die alone and unnoticed

#150

Post by reagency »

polarix wrote: post #123
cousin_it wrote: post #92

That's a big problem with technological progress. It fulfills more and more of our needs, making it harder and harder to fulfill our need to be needed . Sure, you can give everyone basic income and robot caretakers, but people who aren't needed by other people will still suffer. I would much prefer it if society somehow changed itself to want and need all of its members, not just the young productive desirable ones.…

That sounds insanely dystopian to me, for the fact that any member of that society is viscerally dependent on others -- anyone who claims to value freedom needs to think again. Being needed is crucially instrumental toward controlling one's own experience in the current environment. But why would it ever be a terminal value?

Why should freedom be a terminal value? Freedom is an instrument to attain your goals, not a goal in itself. A rock has freedom.
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