I quit the tech industry • Hacker News Board

Re: I quit the tech industry

#491

Post by bcheung » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 9:06 PM UTC

pjungwir wrote: post #476

bcheung wrote: post #470

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not a fan of Dave Ramsey. He's great if you don't know finance but his advice is geared towards people in the poor and lower middle class brackets that want to stay there. Same with Suze Orman. Get an overfunded whole life policy and put the extra money into that. Google "Infinite Banking" or "Cash Flow Banking" to understand how it works. Current guaranteed rates are 4.5% with dividends it comes out to around 5.5% (…

I really appreciate your comments! So what are the downsides of a whole life policy? It can't all be pros and no cons, right?

The downsides are:

1) It can tie up cash flow. If you don't make the minimum payments your policy can "eat itself" until it lapses, at which point you lose that money. That being said, there is a large degree of flexibility when designing policies. Set the minimum low and contribute more. Fall back to the minimum when times get hard. If you are further into the policy it can self-fund (basically the dividend payments can cover the premiums and then some). At that point, you don't need to continue any money whatsoever to continue the policy. Most people still contribute money though since it is effectively free interest.

2) It has high load in the beginning. It typically requires 7 years just to break even. The first 3 years you typically will be losing money. It's only designed for long term.

3) You have to be able to qualify for insurance. If you can't you can insure someone you have an interest in parent, child, spouse, sibling, nephew, etc.

You're basically trading a little bit of flexibility with your cash flow in the beginning. If that money is going to be going towards investments anyway though, it really is a good strategy.

Also, you can always take out a loan against in the policy to invest in something else. If you have a decent investment you're actually getting increased leverage.

See this video for how this strategy can be used with real estate investing to get much higher returns:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgK_dOIesZo

Re: I quit the tech industry

#492

Post by thomas943 » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 9:08 PM UTC

dang wrote: post #469

thomas943 wrote: post #400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Can this post be laden with slightly more privilege? Sadly, it probably was laden with even more obnoxious privilege and what we are reading is the edited version. I'm in my late twenties and I am constantly amazed by how pathetic, obnoxious, and truly useless the younger generations have made themselves. This person wants donations to play with pokemons after letting us know they paid off their mortgage. My only h…

> My only hope is that this blog post prevents this person from ever being hired again. Please don't use HN this way. You're more than welcome to make substantive comments, but pouring vitriol in response to something annoying harms the discourse here. We all have the temptation, but it's important to resist it. Otherwise—long experience shows—the community becomes toxic. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.h…

Labeling my comment as vitriol is a pretty insubstantial exaggeration. For all either one of us knows, the author has not given any thought to how their knee-jerk blog post will affect them years from now, when they've tired of playing with their pokemons and need to figure out how to pay their bills again. With any luck, my comment will induce a moment of self-reflection and allow them to consider whether their short lived catharsis from publicly humblebragging about quitting a high-paying, 100% remote job with stock options will negatively affect them in the future.

Re: I quit the tech industry

#493

Post by nikanj » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 9:17 PM UTC

themckman wrote: post #257

lighthawk wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's likely the author brought it on themselves by pushing too hard. Don't fall into the trap of thinking this. It is the case some of the time, but not all of the time. When I first started working in tech in the mid-90s, it was only a year or two before I was considering going back to school in music or to get an MBA. Since about 2004, I've known that I would like to abandon the tech industry. It is now 2015. I h…

I've talked to several developers over the years that dream of being a groundskeeper. A little about this. I worked plenty of my summers at a country club (my dad is a superintendent) and there is something to the work. There's some really shitty jobs (how about weed-eating the the creek banks in 90 degree temps and 90% humidity?), but mowing grass can be really enjoyable. When working at nicer clubs there is a certa…

> It's funny how when we're young we'll look at a job like that with a sort of scorn as if we've got better things to do, but then as you get older you long a little for those nice summer days of cruising up and down the fairways, just you and your machine.

The problem with a job like this is the lack of variety. Cruising up and down the same fairways for the seventeenth year can really get to you.

Re: I quit the tech industry

#494

Post by AdeptusAquinas » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 9:23 PM UTC

mpdehaan2 wrote: post #139

probablyfiction wrote: post #17

This is what burnout looks like. Unless Yelp has a toxic work culture, it's likely the author brought it on themselves by pushing too hard. After several months, the author will probably start thinking about work again, and begin the job search once more. Not to say that the author's points are invalid; it's a terrible feeling to have to spend your most productive hours working on someone else's problems. He or she m…

While not burnout related, I found out a while back, and this is somewhat paradoxical, that if I care TOO much, I'm less happy. What happens is I notice all the stuff I can't fix, or need to fix, and other people get stressed out making them fix it. The end result is that I stop caring quite as much (I still care), get happy, and then start caring too much again. It's especially hard at times when you have a lot of e…

This is totally true. I find when I am most depressed and irritable about work is when I have become too engaged in it.

Pulling back and seeing it as just work, just time you are selling to someone else, clears my head and paradoxically makes me a better co-worker both in attitude and performance. Then I slowly get drawn back in and depressed again.

Its a cycle, but at least I can see it happening now rather than just getting burnt out.

Re: I quit the tech industry

#495

Post by tmorton » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 9:25 PM UTC

bcheung wrote: post #470

pjungwir wrote: post #436

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The "Dave Ramsey" approach of paying down debt rather than investing is appealing to me, and I think a lot of people ignore the extra risk of investing. If I can make 4.5% risk-free paying off a mortgage vs 6% in stocks, I'd pay off the mortgage. But here is another consideration I've never seen discussed before: mortgage interest is static, but investment returns are dynamic. My mortgage interest rate is fixed for 3…

Not a fan of Dave Ramsey. He's great if you don't know finance but his advice is geared towards people in the poor and lower middle class brackets that want to stay there. Same with Suze Orman. Get an overfunded whole life policy and put the extra money into that. Google "Infinite Banking" or "Cash Flow Banking" to understand how it works. Current guaranteed rates are 4.5% with dividends it comes out to around 5.5% (…

Whole life policies are pretty terrible, because they're high-fee and opaque. It's very difficult to compare them like-to-like, and that's on purpose - each insurance company wants to sell a slightly different set of guarantees, risks, benefits and fees. Term life insurance is what you need to protect your family. 401ks, IRAs, then simple index funds are superior investment vehicles.

Here's the really short guide to life insurance: http://www.reddit.com/r/personalfinance/wiki/insurance

Re: I quit the tech industry

#496

Post by thomas943 » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 9:29 PM UTC

oinksoft wrote: post #484

thomas943 wrote: post #400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Can this post be laden with slightly more privilege? Sadly, it probably was laden with even more obnoxious privilege and what we are reading is the edited version. I'm in my late twenties and I am constantly amazed by how pathetic, obnoxious, and truly useless the younger generations have made themselves. This person wants donations to play with pokemons after letting us know they paid off their mortgage. My only h…

I hate to break this to you, but as somebody of similar age, we are the "younger generation," at least in the professional world. Beyond that, "the young'ns are useless!" is a tired trope. If anything I notice recent grads being wiser and more industrious than my peers were at that age, possibly due to some combination of being too young to have experienced most of the peaceful and prosperous 90's, the economic fallo…

Speaking of tired tropes... "lukewarm 'liberal' politics of the Obama administration with its burgeoning surveillance state". Every statement is a tired trope to someone somewhere, and tip toeing around trying to make each of your thoughts seem like a completely original and unique snowflake is not something I'm interested in.

See my comment below in response to dang if my opinion on the article caused you to hurt in some way.

Re: I quit the tech industry

#497

Post by nomel » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 9:35 PM UTC

lighthawk wrote: post #158

probablyfiction wrote: post #17

This is what burnout looks like. Unless Yelp has a toxic work culture, it's likely the author brought it on themselves by pushing too hard. After several months, the author will probably start thinking about work again, and begin the job search once more. Not to say that the author's points are invalid; it's a terrible feeling to have to spend your most productive hours working on someone else's problems. He or she m…

> it's likely the author brought it on themselves by pushing too hard. Don't fall into the trap of thinking this. It is the case some of the time, but not all of the time. When I first started working in tech in the mid-90s, it was only a year or two before I was considering going back to school in music or to get an MBA. Since about 2004, I've known that I would like to abandon the tech industry. It is now 2015. I h…

> * Talk to a psychiatrist and get some meds.

Do you have experience with this? I'm afraid if I'm on meds, I'll end up neglecting my life even more, rather than taking these strong hints from my mind and body that this isn't the way it should be.

I would absolutely love to hear any perspective on this from anyone.

Re: I quit the tech industry

#498

Post by ghaff » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 9:35 PM UTC

pjungwir wrote: post #436

brightball wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He has actually done one of the best things that he can do in that situation: eliminate expenses. When I tried bootstrapping my startup years ago with periodic contract work the albatross around my neck wasn't anything to do with the company, it was the mortgage and other home expenses that continually made it harder and harder to go without a steady income. People always focus on income without looking at expenses a…

The "Dave Ramsey" approach of paying down debt rather than investing is appealing to me, and I think a lot of people ignore the extra risk of investing. If I can make 4.5% risk-free paying off a mortgage vs 6% in stocks, I'd pay off the mortgage. But here is another consideration I've never seen discussed before: mortgage interest is static, but investment returns are dynamic. My mortgage interest rate is fixed for 3…

And there will be times when equities will lose value. And you can't reliably time any of this anyway. In general, the best strategy is to diversify and maintain some level of liquidity. By all means, pay down your mortgage principle from time to time (or increase your monthly payment a bit) but probably not to the degree that you have no equity investments and/or very little cash on hand.

Re: I quit the tech industry

#499

Post by lgieron » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 9:38 PM UTC

akgerber wrote: post #452

mootothemax wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how come it's so cheap to live in poland? Off the top of my head: - The state's still transitioning from a post-communist economy. - Wages are very low. - Relatively high emigration rate "brain drain" (although people are starting to return). - More supply, less demand. You can buy a brand new apartment close to the centre for somewhere around $2000 per square metre / $200 per square foot. Depending on how your housi…

There are plenty of parts of the United States with similar housing costs.

But these were the prices for a big, vibrant city. If you go to places with worse economy, it can get as low as $600 per square metre - in/near a nice historic city cente. And there are virtually no guns or organized crime in Poland, so even in poorer areas there isn't that much to be worried about in terms of security.

Re: I quit the tech industry

#500

Post by manigandham » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 9:50 PM UTC

agentultra wrote: post #180

reitoei wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did exactly this. Was contracting for 8 years in Dublin, commuting almost 3 hours daily. I was making good (but not amazing) money. Then the kids came, and that 3 hour commute became 3 hours that I could spend helping my wife or spending time with my kids. Got offered a full-time job in the tech industry with (gaaasp pension!) outside of Dublin, 5 minutes from my front door, with better salary, bonuses and healthca…

A pension? I've never heard of a pension in tech (though I am from a different country than you). I've never heard of companies taking part of their earnings to invest in the well being of their people. The most I have heard of are perks like ping-pong, a free beer once in a while, and conferences. They often even give you a computer to work on! And a chair to sit in! (I kid you not, these are often listed as perks i…

A private pension (where the company pays for retirement) just doesnt make sense when lots of major tech companies havent even been around for a decade. This model was a better fit for when companies would last 50+ years and people would have their entire career at a single company.

These days its better handled by a federal/social investment fund that all companies contribute to and then pays out to each individual. But that's basically social security.