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Musk files to provide Internet service from space

washingtonpost.com

81–90 of 129 posts

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note that countries have not succeeded in stopping satellite phone users within their borders... for example, the Taliban in Afghanistan use satellite phones extensively.

Are those phone companies breaking the law when they let the call on to their network?

Depends which law, and which country.

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#82
post #58
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The speed of light is faster in space than it is in optical fibre. Could you elaborate? Thanks

My understanding of it is that when light passes through a medium, it does not do so in a straight line. So, while the actual speed of light remains constant, it takes longer to get from one end to the other.

To be precise, light can travel through a medium in a straight line, but it bends when it passes from one material to another. The light bounces off the inner walls of the fiber in a zig-zag fashion as it propagates, so it cannot possibly travel at the speed of light. It depends on the index of refraction as mentioned.

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#83
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't the internet by very definition a grid?

By which definition? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Off-the-grid

The internet is a grid of computers to which you connect.

More than that though, conceptually "off-the-grid" means not accepting a utility serivce from a provider but rather catering for that yourself. An internet connection is arguably a utility, and you'd be accepting it from an ISP. That goes against the concept, which would suggest you should maintain your own isolated network of computers and not connect with the outside world.

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> With low orbit devices I would imagine the latency should be better, I am guessing, but how much better. Your satellite's 22,000 miles above the earth. If you were directly under it, round trip latency would be 236ms. If these satellites are 684 miles up, and you were directly under one, round trip latency would be just 7ms. The distance between satellites, and between the satellites and whatever ground stations ac…

FEC and interleaving induced latency will likely become the dominant term for LEOs.

What numbers are we talking?

Shorter distance + faster signal thru air can amount up to 30-50% lower latency.

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#85
post #2

Musk claims to want to launch 4,000 or so satellites. The Goddard Space Flight Center indicates that there are 2,271 satellites in orbit now. I'm wondering to what degree this would make it more likely to have a negative feedback loop of satellite destruction in the case of a satellite being hit by space junk.

I believe they would be low enough that if they failed they would pretty quickly fall back into the atmosphere, and be replaced on the fly. I'm pretty sure I heard this in his talk about it in Washington on youtube.

No, that's not the case at 1,100km. That's true only for LEO.

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#86
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How will devices on the ground communicate with the satellites? i.e. do we still need fixed dishes, or are we looking at something new so an iPhone can get signal right from the satellite?

I believe Musk is, like Teledesic, planning to use the Ka-band. That means the smallest antenna would be the size of a large laptop (and that's only if phased arrays become cheap enough). So, it would work for a car, plane, boat, or house, but would be too big to use while walking.

Will it still need gyro mechanism?

There are satellite (I think Ku band) dishes for larger (~50ft) boats nowadays. They are using gyroscope assisted motors that wouldn't suffice for compensating rolling motion of a smaller boat.

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#87
post #50
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is the orbit for current satellite ISPs?

Iridium SATs are in LEO at 485 mi

Though there's only one civil ground station, so the latency to your wired neighbour can still mean an around-the-world trip.

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe Musk is, like Teledesic, planning to use the Ka-band. That means the smallest antenna would be the size of a large laptop (and that's only if phased arrays become cheap enough). So, it would work for a car, plane, boat, or house, but would be too big to use while walking.

Will it still need gyro mechanism? There are satellite (I think Ku band) dishes for larger (~50ft) boats nowadays. They are using gyroscope assisted motors that wouldn't suffice for compensating rolling motion of a smaller boat.

[deleted]

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe Musk is, like Teledesic, planning to use the Ka-band. That means the smallest antenna would be the size of a large laptop (and that's only if phased arrays become cheap enough). So, it would work for a car, plane, boat, or house, but would be too big to use while walking.

Will it still need gyro mechanism? There are satellite (I think Ku band) dishes for larger (~50ft) boats nowadays. They are using gyroscope assisted motors that wouldn't suffice for compensating rolling motion of a smaller boat.

The laptop-sized antenna he mentioned doesn't need a gyro because it uses phased-array tech. Essentially you resolve signals in any direction (up to a resolution given by number of elements and array size) by carefully combining them with certain phase offsets such that signals from all but one direction cancel out. This adjustment is made on the fly to track a signal with changing direction.

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#90
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The speed of light is faster in space than it is in optical fibre. Could you elaborate? Thanks

http://www.rpi.edu/dept/phys/Dept2/APPhys1/optics/optics/nod... Speed of light in vacuum > speed of light in optical fiber. Same reason high frequency traders are using microwave between Chicago and New York instead of a fiber connection.

Is it possible to build a multi-mode "fiber" with an air core so that a significant part of the light's path is through air? The outer sheath made of optically dense material would only be used for internal reflection to "guide" the beam...
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