Musk files to provide Internet service from space • Hacker News Board

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#41

Post by joshontheweb » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 2:36 AM UTC

The ability to go off-grid is becoming more of a reality for me now. I'd love to be able to get a cabin in the middle of nowhere, slap some solar panels on top still have access to highspeed internet.

Even if you didn't want to go off-grid, this could open up a lot of developing countries to being more viable remote-working locations. I recently spent some time in Bali and considered moving there for awhile but ultimately couldn't solely because the internet was too slow and unreliable.

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#42

Post by havatar » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 2:38 AM UTC

x0054 wrote: post #30

apkessl1 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good question. The vast majority of satellite communications today are conducted via geostationary orbit, 35,786 km above the earth. This is the distance at which a satellite orbiting around the equator moves with the same velocity as the surface of the earth, keeping the satellite in a fixed position. This is good for communicating via the ground, since you can just set up your dish pointing in the direction of the…

Hmm, interesting. Well, I have Exede Satellite service as my ISP (best I can get) and my best latency, to any server, is 800ms. The way I figure it, 35,786 km / 300 miles per ms would be 120ms up * 4 for the round trip. So that's 480ms, plus another 20ms-100ms to a google or another large server. So that's theoretical latency of 600ms, so where are the other 200ms of latency coming from! :( I am wondering because I m…

look into mosh, a ssh replacement for high latency connections.

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#43

Post by tdaltonc » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 2:39 AM UTC

geomark wrote: post #32

From the article: "SpaceX would need permission from countries to operate the service, a process that could be difficult, if not impossible." Yep. To operate in many countries an ISP has to block access to a lot of content. It differs greatly from country-to-country. Would they really get involved in that? That would mean taking orders from governments all over the world and implementing blocks per those orders. Or w…

I doubt he would, but just as a though exercise: What would happen if he started answering http requests from space for free? Would that be a crime?

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#44

Post by nostromo » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 2:39 AM UTC

geomark wrote: post #32

From the article: "SpaceX would need permission from countries to operate the service, a process that could be difficult, if not impossible." Yep. To operate in many countries an ISP has to block access to a lot of content. It differs greatly from country-to-country. Would they really get involved in that? That would mean taking orders from governments all over the world and implementing blocks per those orders. Or w…

It's pretty easy to ignore laws from space.

Reference satellite TV in the middle east. Al-Jazeera is banned in many countries, but still has high penetration as users just ignore the laws.

Saudi Arabia has an outright ban on satellite television... yet 97% of Saudis have access to satellite television. [1]

Iran also bans satellite television, yet more than 70 percent of people Tehran watch banned satellite channels. [2]

1. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Television_in_Saudi_Arabia

2. http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2013/12/19/iranian-min...

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#45

Post by tdaltonc » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 2:40 AM UTC

greglindahl wrote: post #39

geomark wrote: post #32

From the article: "SpaceX would need permission from countries to operate the service, a process that could be difficult, if not impossible." Yep. To operate in many countries an ISP has to block access to a lot of content. It differs greatly from country-to-country. Would they really get involved in that? That would mean taking orders from governments all over the world and implementing blocks per those orders. Or w…

Note that countries have not succeeded in stopping satellite phone users within their borders... for example, the Taliban in Afghanistan use satellite phones extensively.

Are those phone companies breaking the law when they let the call on to their network?

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#46

Post by silntbob » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 2:41 AM UTC

savage_platypus wrote: post #29

toomuchtodo wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As opposed to current pipe dreams: * gigafactory under construction * freemont factory producing ~50K vehicles/year * spacex successfully, repeatedly delivering payloads to orbit (and successfully demonstrating their crew escape vehicle recently)

Just because something is being built with other people's money does not make something a success. None of the companies Elon has been involved with have ever actually generated a profit -- they have largely just taken advantage of speculative investors and their willingness to buy into his ideas.

Last time I checked SpaceX was profitable... Just saying...

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#47

Post by BinaryIdiot » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 2:41 AM UTC

savage_platypus wrote: post #29

toomuchtodo wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As opposed to current pipe dreams: * gigafactory under construction * freemont factory producing ~50K vehicles/year * spacex successfully, repeatedly delivering payloads to orbit (and successfully demonstrating their crew escape vehicle recently)

Just because something is being built with other people's money does not make something a success. None of the companies Elon has been involved with have ever actually generated a profit -- they have largely just taken advantage of speculative investors and their willingness to buy into his ideas.

> None of the companies Elon has been involved with have ever actually generated a profit

Bullshit; there are companies he's been involved in that have turned a profit.

Zip2 made a good profit and a great exit - http://news.cnet.com/Compaq+buys+Zip2/2100-1023_3-221675.htm...

X.com / Paypal generates first profits in 2002 - http://www.ecommercebytes.com/cab/abn/y02/m04/i18/s02

SpaceX is profitable - http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-03-04/spacex-pro...

Don't forget SolarCity is turning itself around and will likely turn a profit in a few years (http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2015/02/17/what-to-loo...). The same for Tesla which is expecting to turn a profit in 2020 (http://www.marketwatch.com/story/tesla-wont-turn-profitable-...).

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#48

Post by Cherian » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 2:41 AM UTC

dankohn1 wrote: post #13

I was Director of Marketing with Teledesic, Craig McCaw and Bill Gates's Internet-in-the-Sky from 1995 to 2000. I'm a huge fan of what Musk is doing, with order of magnitude cheaper launch costs and satellite hardware. AMA.

1. At the risk of sounding stupid, will governments allow something like this that can bypass gateways under control?

2. Can cellphone communication work this way on scale (like Iridium)? Bypassing providers like tmobile, sprint etc.

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#49

Post by geomark » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 2:41 AM UTC

greglindahl wrote: post #39

geomark wrote: post #32

From the article: "SpaceX would need permission from countries to operate the service, a process that could be difficult, if not impossible." Yep. To operate in many countries an ISP has to block access to a lot of content. It differs greatly from country-to-country. Would they really get involved in that? That would mean taking orders from governments all over the world and implementing blocks per those orders. Or w…

Note that countries have not succeeded in stopping satellite phone users within their borders... for example, the Taliban in Afghanistan use satellite phones extensively.

Right. That's an alternative, smuggle your satellite internet equipment into a country where it is prohibited. Could be risky during the smuggling. Also very likely easy to detect since it's not exactly a LPI (low probability of intercept) signal.

Re: Musk files to provide Internet service from space

#50

Post by oh_sigh » Wed, Jun 10, 2015, 2:42 AM UTC

shmerl wrote: post #36

shabble wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

and solves the other problem of Big High internet, which is latency. At 1000km you could have single-hop round-trips in <10ms.

What is the orbit for current satellite ISPs?

Iridium SATs are in LEO at 485 mi