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“Swift will be open source later this year”

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Re: “Swift will be open source later this year”

#531

Post by VikingCoder »

parasubvert wrote: post #442
VikingCoder wrote: post #424

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Native mobile is "winning", in terms of being usually a far superior UX, and by sheer numerical demand. Yeah? I could type a URL to anything here, and you could view it. If instead hide my content behind an app, I can't deep link to it. The likelihood of you installing the app to see the content is way lower. You need space on your mobile device to install my app. Potentially a password entered to install it. It ne…

I am a huge proponent of the web architecture, I just think HTML is dying from the politicization of the standards process and resulting slow pace of innovation. "If instead hide my content behind an app, I can't deep link to it. " This is not true. I enter a URL into my iPhone's Safari, it deep links into the App associated with the domain. We just watched a WWDC keynote that showed plenty of deep linking between ap…

> This is also contrary to the data - people love apps, download and use apps like mad.

I just think you and I are talking about way different things...

If I look at the HN main page right now, I see these URLs:

placebobutton.com

talkpythontome.com

dice.com

aol.com

tripwire.com

qz.com

aracrown.org

phys.org

spring.io

250bpm.com

lornajane.net

digitalocean.com

phys.org

csmonitor.com

smartdatacollective.com

golgi.io

fortune.com

ridiculousfish.com

lessthunk.com

whitehouse.gov

thesolutionsproject.org

pamelafox.org

attentiv.com

adp.com

linkedin.com

I could easily see myself spending 15 minutes reading EACH of those webpages.

THERE'S NO FRICKIN WAY I would install apps from each of those places, in order to read their one article on HN this morning. NO WAY.

Re: “Swift will be open source later this year”

#532

Post by shmerl »

greggman wrote: post #466
shmerl wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are actually listed as Vulkan participants: https://www.khronos.org/vulkan No idea what they actually do, but if they'd add Vulkan support to PlayStation, it would be good for developers. Some Apple developers so far participated in SPIR-V / LLVM related discussions. And MS was notably absent in anything related. As I said, when they'll fix this lock-in mentality, I'll second the claim that they seriously change…

Vulkan is still an abstraction. Most PS4 developers I know would prefer the stuff they already have which is closer to the metal. Something that uses the actual instructions for the PS4 GPU and not some cross platform API that then has to be translated to the actual GPU. Yes, PS4 devs porting to PC would likely like Vulkan over OpenGL or DirectX but PS4 devs on PS4 not so much.

Making games for only one platform doesn't make sense since it limits reach, and using tons of incompatible APIs is annoying as well. Vulkan is low enough of an abstraction to perform quite well, so no matter what direction something can be ported, having a common API can save a lot of time.

Here is what some say about it: http://gamingbolt.com/ps4-should-support-vulkan-ps4s-api-not...

Re: “Swift will be open source later this year”

#533

Post by dmacvicar »

sacado2 wrote: post #497
72deluxe wrote: post #486

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your comment is interesting, it has made me want to look at the language, so thanks. But I think that the "friction from what is in your head to code" probably betrays that you weren't settled in a previous language? I only say this because I have zero friction writing C++, and have to think mildly backwards when it comes to C# or Java, and definitely Objective-C. Even PHP is like simplified C++ to me, so I write eve…

> But I think that the "friction from what is in your head to code" probably betrays that you weren't settled in a previous language? I had the same feeling as the user you're answering to. And I have used quite a bunch of languages I've been quite productive with (C, C++, PHP, Python, Java, Ada), but I've never felt with these languages as little "friction" as with Go. I mean, that language is so dumb that you don't…

I was following Rust very entusiastically. But at some point the language was getting itself in the way of the problem I was solving.

I am not only talking about the strict compile checks. I am talking about that extra thinking in the ten ways you can design it and how it should be done in "proper" Rust.

And the friction is not only in the language, but also in the standard library. A language that comes with XML/json marshal/unmarshal plus a quite decent http client/server framework covers most of what I need to do.

I am sure if Rust had included in the standard package http/xml/json it would be far more popular. I understand the voices that say "It does not belong there", "the language is not targeted at that". Fine. But then I found myself having not much user for the language, even if I loved the idea/theory behind it, plus that I could not get comfortable thinking in it.

Re: “Swift will be open source later this year”

#534

Post by kodablah »

tootie wrote: post #517
kodablah wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I toyed with implementing Swift on the JVM (which is very doable by the way). The problem I've found with Swift is the minute size of the standard library. This has forced a large amount of Swift libraries to make calls to Objective-C/Cocoa classes libraries which makes it very non-portable. I haven't checked any time recently, but if a large, stable, swift-specific stdlib were to emerge then I believe it could defin…

I'm curious about how memory management would work. Swift has rejected garbage collection in favor of ARC.

I was going to make it use GC and make ARC-specific constructs a noop (I hadn't decided whether I wanted "weak" to be a JVM WeakReference or not, I did not get that far).

Re: “Swift will be open source later this year”

#535

Post by dmacvicar »

72deluxe wrote: post #498
sacado2 wrote: post #497

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But I think that the "friction from what is in your head to code" probably betrays that you weren't settled in a previous language? I had the same feeling as the user you're answering to. And I have used quite a bunch of languages I've been quite productive with (C, C++, PHP, Python, Java, Ada), but I've never felt with these languages as little "friction" as with Go. I mean, that language is so dumb that you don't…

That's really good that it's so dumb that you don't need to jump through hoops to think of the way to do it. Clever! Just code and go!

It is not unicorns either.

* Transforming a collection means doing boring for loops instead of one-liners. * interfaces/duck typing is great. But hey, []interface{} does not fit into interface{}. * Structs with fields are encouraged, but there is no uniform Uniform access principle and that sucks. * etc

But definitely, my own "science" confirms that it turned to be out less of a problem (for my own usage) compared to better languages with more friction.

Re: “Swift will be open source later this year”

#536

Post by aikinai »

kristopolous wrote: post #523
jedrek wrote: post #510

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Hackintoshing has proven to be quite elusive I've been using a hackintosh since 2008. It's literally never been easier to get one up and running.

So many people report success but a half dozen attempts with 20 years of computing to back me up has been nothing but abysmal failure. I don't know what kind of magical book of voodoo spells these people are using. I wonder if the web is just biased towards success because generally the people who haven't succeeded have nothing to say. If so, it would be nice to get insight on the whole picture here somehow

Skyline OS X is a great resource for getting a solid And simple Hackintosh install. I'd recommend trying the guides there.

http://skylineosx.com

Re: “Swift will be open source later this year”

#537

Post by sacado2 »

dmacvicar wrote: post #535
72deluxe wrote: post #498

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's really good that it's so dumb that you don't need to jump through hoops to think of the way to do it. Clever! Just code and go!

It is not unicorns either. * Transforming a collection means doing boring for loops instead of one-liners. * interfaces/duck typing is great. But hey, []interface{} does not fit into interface{}. * Structs with fields are encouraged, but there is no uniform Uniform access principle and that sucks. * etc But definitely, my own "science" confirms that it turned to be out less of a problem (for my own usage) compared to…

Yep. I've been bored by the fact that putting an []int into an []interface{} doesn't work, too (although the reason is obvious).

Re: “Swift will be open source later this year”

#538

Post by vorg »

jophde wrote: post #271
zak_mc_kracken wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm saying this because it'll be a huge benefit to Android. reply How so? The language has a weaker type system than Java, doesn't support exceptions and requires error checking every other line, has very poor tool support (because the compiler was not designed with IDE's in mind). Except maybe add a few developers who refused to write code on Android because of Java, I really don't see what Go would bring to Andro…

You shouldn't be getting down-voted. The idea of anyone rewriting the entire Android Framework in Go when you can use better languages like Kotlin, Scala, Groovy, Clojure is asinine. Go will compile to Android architectures so you could do shared code in Go between iOS and Android like a C++ lib. That makes sense.

> That would leave you with Kotlin/Groovy/Clojure/Scala for the view layer of your Android app if you choose not use Java

> when you can use better languages like Kotlin, Scala, Groovy, Clojure is asinine

You seem to be piggybacking an aspiring JVM language (Kotlin) on top of three other alternative ones that have already made it (Scala,Groovy,Clojure). Because that trick's already been done before with them (i.e. Groovy piggybacked on the quality of Scala and Clojure), it makes your list of examples of alternative JVM languages seem disingenuous.

Re: “Swift will be open source later this year”

#539

Post by wiredfool »

digi_owl wrote: post #305
Zenst wrote: post #303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very true and probably more so when Job was somewhat into computer render animation. That and attention to a good working audio driver setup and API's have helped keep Apple still in the audio DAW industry. AS you say much has changed and can see why they shifted focus. Though I do as many wish they at least had a server flavour, more so given would not be much to change I feel as to what is already there. But exposu…

Don't they already offer that via their Airport range of routers? I seem to recall they offer file storage/backup, perhaps even with a iCloud link.

I really wish that the airport extreme routers would expose an itunes home sharing service, so that those of us with laptops and way too much music/videos could stream to airport express/appletv/itunes home sharing without having to have a machine dedicated to the task.

Re: “Swift will be open source later this year”

#540

Post by avinassh »

jophde wrote: post #299

Please for the love of all things holy please stop saying Swift would be great for Android or that Google is porting Go to Android. As an Android developer for the past four years I can assure you that there is zero evidence that Google is moving the Android FRAMEWORK to Go. There aren't even any plans to support lambdas and Java 8. Also, pretty much everyone on the bleeding edge of Android is planning on moving to K…

Any apps which are written using Kotlin, are on Google Playstore? If yes, link?
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