Why I Defaulted on My Student Loans
21–30 of 32 posts
Re: Why I Defaulted on My Student Loans
#22Why do people like this absolve themselves of all responsibility. You made the choice to take out all those loans and attend a liberal arts college, good for you and now it is time for you to pay up. While you got to party in College on someone else's dime, I worked 80 hours per week and built my career. I'm sorry your choice didn't pan out the way you thought it would but I'm really getting tired of the idea that pe…
The truth is these kids aren't really adults, and no one along the way is incentivized to stop them and say "hey, you may be making a really terrible decision here." Instead, everyone encourages them. English major? Great! No major? Even better! You have time to decide! $100k in debt? A degree is worth it! Thankfully I had programming skills to fall back on, but when you're 18 years old and you're surrounded by peopl…
I remember being 18 and I was terrified of loans, or of any kind of arrangements that could limit the options of my future! Advices, even ones that come from well-intended people, weren't worth much for me if they weren't supported by detailed plans in which I would end up OK. Receiving such insurance plans proved to be next to impossible, because and as you may presume, those who seriously suggest you mortgaging your life aren't the most forward-looking people!
...so no, I don't sympathize with that naive kid not thinking straight about his own future. I actually feel that this kind of practice represents one of our time's laws of natural selection.
Re: Why I Defaulted on My Student Loans
#23Why do people like this absolve themselves of all responsibility. You made the choice to take out all those loans and attend a liberal arts college, good for you and now it is time for you to pay up. While you got to party in College on someone else's dime, I worked 80 hours per week and built my career. I'm sorry your choice didn't pan out the way you thought it would but I'm really getting tired of the idea that pe…
Well, to give a german perspective, over here it is considered unfair. To such an extend that tuition is basically free. The thing is we do not think one should indept himself to be able to achieve a degree, nor should he be forced to work to such an extend. I mean i admire you man, but looking carefully around you, you have got to admit that not everyone would be able to do this, would they? People over here got enr…
Re: Why I Defaulted on My Student Loans
#24But...
I was talking to my sister the other day, who just graduated from an Ivy League school. All her life she's been in accelerated programs with other well-to-do kids. I realized that she has always interacted with people with above average intelligence, above average connections, above average wealth. I'm betting that many HNers have at least one of those privileges. The overwhelming majority of people do not.
Over time I see a recurring theme: that people who are uneducated and poor are so easily taken advantage of. I've seen single moms lease $30000 SUVs for 600 a month. People who, after work, sit in front of the television and spend -all their money on the weekends.
The world makes it so easy to fuck up. I always have to remind myself, a person with the single privilege of above average intelligence: what is obvious to me is not obvious to others. Yes, books are ubiquitous and cheap. Yes, people should know what they are signing up for. Yes, debts should be paid. But perhaps these things some of us take for granted as simple realities are not so obvious for an overwhelming majority. It is not their fault.
Re: Why I Defaulted on My Student Loans
#25Why do people like this absolve themselves of all responsibility. You made the choice to take out all those loans and attend a liberal arts college, good for you and now it is time for you to pay up. While you got to party in College on someone else's dime, I worked 80 hours per week and built my career. I'm sorry your choice didn't pan out the way you thought it would but I'm really getting tired of the idea that pe…
The truth is these kids aren't really adults, and no one along the way is incentivized to stop them and say "hey, you may be making a really terrible decision here." Instead, everyone encourages them. English major? Great! No major? Even better! You have time to decide! $100k in debt? A degree is worth it! Thankfully I had programming skills to fall back on, but when you're 18 years old and you're surrounded by peopl…
I do think our concept of adulthood is flawed and has major issues, but society will never tolerate fixing it because it would restrict rights based on abilities and many of those who are currently taken advantage of will not willingly surrender the rights that allow them to be taken advantage of.
Re: Why I Defaulted on My Student Loans
#26My first reaction was the same as many comments below. "He made a poor choice and now doesn't want to take responsibility." But... I was talking to my sister the other day, who just graduated from an Ivy League school. All her life she's been in accelerated programs with other well-to-do kids. I realized that she has always interacted with people with above average intelligence, above average connections, above avera…
The alternative is to tell them they aren't educated enough to take out a lease.
Imagine how this would be applied to other scenarios. Say... telling someone they aren't educated/financially secure enough to have children.
Re: Why I Defaulted on My Student Loans
#27It all went to hell in 2005 because of this little gem: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bankruptcy_Abuse_Prevention_and... See, there are two primary forms of financing for higher education: The heavily regulated federal market, where the federal government guarantees the loans, but also maintains rules that ensure that repayment is affordable by way of myriad flexibility in repayment (including a very reasonable $50k t…
Re: Why I Defaulted on My Student Loans
#28I don't understand how people can be so sure that they've made the right choice: If society isn't willing to give you anything for it, how are you sure it's your 'usefulness in life'? Usefulness to whom? How is this person supposed to be a sympathetic character, when he paid none of the investment towards higher education, reaped a number of the benefits, and then lumps people who played by the rules/lived within the…
Because usefulness isn't measured only in money.
(Think of the children! No, really. They cost a ton, no guarantee they'll live to support you in your dotage even, but people still have them.)
Re: Why I Defaulted on My Student Loans
#29Earlier quoted context omitted.
Well, to give a german perspective, over here it is considered unfair. To such an extend that tuition is basically free. The thing is we do not think one should indept himself to be able to achieve a degree, nor should he be forced to work to such an extend. I mean i admire you man, but looking carefully around you, you have got to admit that not everyone would be able to do this, would they? People over here got enr…
I've explained this before: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9102059 - when you start considering the entire world as the marketplace for the fruits of education, this (taxpayer subsidized) model leaves you in a bad position.
There even was a article linked here about USA student coming to germany for education this week. It said that most of them stay. Turns out if you spend like 5 of your formative years at one place, you kind of build roots there. So maybe an attractive education system can actually help securing talent.
There even was a statement by a german official which roughly said that they are very happy with the current state of affairs, having the international exchange. If things get too out of hand, tuition fees for foreign students will be explored as an option though.
Re: Why I Defaulted on My Student Loans
#30Earlier quoted context omitted.
I've explained this before: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9102059 - when you start considering the entire world as the marketplace for the fruits of education, this (taxpayer subsidized) model leaves you in a bad position.
Well, actually its working out fine atm, thank you :) There even was a article linked here about USA student coming to germany for education this week. It said that most of them stay. Turns out if you spend like 5 of your formative years at one place, you kind of build roots there. So maybe an attractive education system can actually help securing talent. There even was a statement by a german official which roughly…
So Germany invested by subsidizing some (foreign) students and manages to benefit from the fruits of its own education investment - this is hardly the context I was talking about. I was talking about the case where a country like Germany educates for free its own citizens then they leave for greener pastures. The fact that your government managed to sell you the idea that everything is all right because at least some of the subsidized students (foreign and German) will stay is relevant only to your subjective contentment level. The overall picture can be judged pretty objectively.
"Turns out if you spend like 5 of your formative years at one place, you kind of build roots there."
These kind of people would probably rooted anywhere, in any condition, as its just a thing in their nature, not something to present as a resulting advantage of a given system. Maybe a small part them came to Germany because of something unique that they couldn't possibly find anywhere else, but I think that most likely the majority came to Germany just because of the prohibitive education costs in their own country. That's to say someone else's education system has a problem (by being unattractive in the current conditions) and that secures you incoming talent now. Just expecting others to continue having problems is not a very solid plan to rely on. I believe that it's possible to design the system a little bit better, where the students that have access to subsidized education may come to feel the education debts only when they try to emigrate (and take away the results of that subsidized education) or some other kind of solution to the leakage of public investment.