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“A Statement with My View on Curtis Yarvin and Strange Loop”

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Re: “A Statement with My View on Curtis Yarvin and Strange Loop”

#361

Post by patrissimo1976 »

topynate wrote: post #276
cwyers wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a slippery slope fallacy. It turns out that in reality we are quite capable of allowing tech conferences to choose their presenters and to disallow presenters who have made uncomfortably racist comments without ending up at the point where it has a chilling effect on other types of speech.

I flatly deny that the process as described is capable of discernment. What happened was: speaker announced, lots of people complain, conference organiser withdraws invitation to avoid focus on "inclusion and/or presence." Note that the organiser explicitly excluded consideration of the merits of the complaints. Now compare my invocation elsewhere in this thread of the spectre of an anti-Zionist boycott: the complain…

I agree with you, but one point of caution is that the NRX movement that Yarvin helped found has many avowedly anti-semitic members who see "Jews" as part of the forces that oppress them.

None of this came from Yarvin, who is Jewish, and well worth defending, but get much beyond him into the movement and you'll be supporting anti-semitism, not tolerance.

Re: “A Statement with My View on Curtis Yarvin and Strange Loop”

#363

Post by lackbeard »

devalier wrote: post #349
tptacek wrote: post #343

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no possibility that you will convince me, and so I think that particular discussion is not a good use of either of our time. No part of the obstacle you'd face in trying involves other people's opinions of me; I feel very comfortable with the subsets of people that incline towards and against taking me seriously. If it helps, you can think of my opposition to the notion that blacks are somehow intellectually…

There is no possibility that you will convince me Is there any possible evidence, any possible information, that could convince you that genes for IQ were not equally distributed among the races? For my sake, there would be plenty of possible information that would convince me of the idea of neurological uniformity across ethnic groups, for example: studies of cross-racial adoption that showed the gap being erased, t…

>If I can be convinced by evidence, but you cannot be convinced by evidence, then it is you who has a religious belief, and not me.

He just stated that his belief is religious...

(Well, he didn't state that exactly, but he did state that you may as well treat it as such.)

Re: “A Statement with My View on Curtis Yarvin and Strange Loop”

#364

Post by devalier »

lackbeard wrote: post #363
devalier wrote: post #349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no possibility that you will convince me Is there any possible evidence, any possible information, that could convince you that genes for IQ were not equally distributed among the races? For my sake, there would be plenty of possible information that would convince me of the idea of neurological uniformity across ethnic groups, for example: studies of cross-racial adoption that showed the gap being erased, t…

>If I can be convinced by evidence, but you cannot be convinced by evidence, then it is you who has a religious belief, and not me. He just stated that his belief is religious... (Well, he didn't state that exactly, but he did state that you may as well treat it as such.)

Oh, I think you're right, I parsed his comment incorrectly.

Re: “A Statement with My View on Curtis Yarvin and Strange Loop”

#365

Post by defen »

tptacek wrote: post #330
lexcorvus wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have read it. I don't find "But Not NOT One, Either" to be an accurate characterization. Basically, Moldbug's position is that white nationalists include lots of vile racists, but that by itself doesn't mean they're wrong about everything, and we should evaluate such ideas critically if we want to actually solve the problems they identify (which in fact many progressives would identify as well, though the phrasing…

Your choices of what to quote are telling. For instance, one of those quotes is preceded by a lengthy (and thinly veiled) Derbyshire-esque description of black people as social ill. Shortly after it, we have these cheerful grafs: This is the trouble with white nationalism. It is strategically barren. It offers no effective political program. You can be as smart as you want and think about white nationalism forever, a…

The funniest part about this is that you quote "If allowing the old cities of North America to be overrun and rendered largely uninhabitable by murderous racist gangs isn't bad government, really, I'm not sure what is." as prima facie evidence that Yarvin is unfit for polite society, while apparently living in a city where 38 people were shot last weekend (and over 1000 so far this year) by the same racist gangs he speaks of.

Re: “A Statement with My View on Curtis Yarvin and Strange Loop”

#366

Post by tptacek »

defen wrote: post #365
tptacek wrote: post #330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your choices of what to quote are telling. For instance, one of those quotes is preceded by a lengthy (and thinly veiled) Derbyshire-esque description of black people as social ill. Shortly after it, we have these cheerful grafs: This is the trouble with white nationalism. It is strategically barren. It offers no effective political program. You can be as smart as you want and think about white nationalism forever, a…

The funniest part about this is that you quote "If allowing the old cities of North America to be overrun and rendered largely uninhabitable by murderous racist gangs isn't bad government, really, I'm not sure what is." as prima facie evidence that Yarvin is unfit for polite society, while apparently living in a city where 38 people were shot last weekend (and over 1000 so far this year) by the same racist gangs he s…

The overwhelming majority of violence in Chicago is gang violence between predominantly African American gangs, confined to poor neighborhoods that are the direct product of segregation, redlining, and "white flight". That's not a reaching analysis and it isn't "SJW"-speak; it is the clear, documented history of the city of Chicago.

So, two responses to your weird comment.

First: it's false that Chicago gangs are "racist". They aren't hunting down white people. They're hunting down rival gangs. They do that because they are, for the most part, teenagers locked in a vicious cycle of poverty and a total lack of opportunity.

Second: it's extremely sad if from these circumstances you've managed, like Yarvin seems to have, to draw a conclusion about the inferiority of African Americans.

I don't know you, but I feel like I've seen your name around HN for awhile now, and I hadn't had any reason to attach "racially prejudiced" to what little metadata I store about you. I'm hoping instead that I've just misread you. But "racist gangs" is a term you chose to use, which is disquieting.

Re: “A Statement with My View on Curtis Yarvin and Strange Loop”

#367

Post by valvar »

tptacek wrote: post #321
yarvin9 wrote: post #259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, but no. urbit, from the Latin urbs == city, is actually a good bit older than UR. The initials are somehow very compelling - another couple of great literary UR blogs are the Unz Review (unz.com) and Uncouth Reflections (uncouthreflections.com). I will admit that urbit has very few users, as technically we're really not launched at all. We were thinking Strange Loop might be a good place for this, but I guess…

I stand corrected about the name. Here's an honest summary of what I think: I find it very easy to see the importance of a serious general-purpose overlay network, since I think that's the future of the Internet, so much so that I think something like Urbit will make IPv6 irrelevant. I'm philosophically inclined to appreciate that work. I find that the programming model you've attached to it --- the Nock/Hoon stuff -…

Yarvin has had at least one other talk (that I know of) about Urbit, and he did not so much as mention anything non-technical. I don't see what grounds you have to assume such a thing about him without any prior evidence of such behaviour having occurred previously.

Re: “A Statement with My View on Curtis Yarvin and Strange Loop”

#368

Post by gclaramunt »

yummyfajitas wrote: post #283
gclaramunt wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the same vein I would love to see the people defending the talk arguing in favor of a Noam Chomsky presentation

I would absolutely defend Noam Chomsky's right to give a talk on, e.g., context free grammars. Strangely, neoreactionary and libertarian types aren't so aggressive at shutting down debate. It's almost as if they feel they can win in the marketplace of ideas.

Meh, I'm pretty sure we won't hear from the same guys if the speaker were somebody else, but I can't prove it so I leave it here :)

Re: “A Statement with My View on Curtis Yarvin and Strange Loop”

#369

Post by gclaramunt »

twoodfin wrote: post #162
gclaramunt wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the same vein I would love to see the people defending the talk arguing in favor of a Noam Chomsky presentation

If it was technically interesting and met the same standards that saw the Urbit talk selected as one of dozens out of hundreds, bring it on. Do you think classical liberals don't read "Syntactic Structures"?

> Do you think classical liberals don't read "Syntactic Structures"?

Never doubted that

Re: “A Statement with My View on Curtis Yarvin and Strange Loop”

#370

Post by defen »

tptacek wrote: post #366
defen wrote: post #365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The funniest part about this is that you quote "If allowing the old cities of North America to be overrun and rendered largely uninhabitable by murderous racist gangs isn't bad government, really, I'm not sure what is." as prima facie evidence that Yarvin is unfit for polite society, while apparently living in a city where 38 people were shot last weekend (and over 1000 so far this year) by the same racist gangs he s…

The overwhelming majority of violence in Chicago is gang violence between predominantly African American gangs, confined to poor neighborhoods that are the direct product of segregation, redlining, and "white flight". That's not a reaching analysis and it isn't "SJW"-speak; it is the clear, documented history of the city of Chicago. So, two responses to your weird comment. First: it's false that Chicago gangs are "ra…

I didn't say that they are hunting down white people. But it is inarguable that gangs in America (whether Crips, Bloods, Mafia, Russian-, MS-13, Irish, the Aryan Brotherhood, or otherwise) are organized along racial/ethnic lines. I would argue that violent street gangs are much more racist than software engineers are sexist, for example; but if I were to say "It is false that there is a sexism problem in tech" you would probably strongly disagree.
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