Welcome to America: Here's Your Linux Computer • Hacker News Board

Re: Welcome to America: Here's Your Linux Computer

#31

Post by redwards510 » Fri, Jun 05, 2015, 4:55 PM UTC

kenrikm wrote: post #17

w1ntermute wrote: post #2

It's good to know that you're providing Linux PCs to those who can't afford them, but let's be realistic - unless they turn out to be really interested in computers, as soon as the kids start working and get some money, they'll go out and buy the same shiny iDevices that all their peers covet.

~95% of the developers I know in the Bay Area use MacBook Pros. The underlying Unix base Apple runs on is nothing to scoff at and the majority of things someone learns about the command line on a linux machine will be the same on a OSX machine. I'm surprised you point out iDevices, what we should be worried about is keeping them away from the Windows ecosystem.

Instead of trying to impose your silly Apple Vs Microsoft drama on small children, we should focus on getting them laptops. Any laptops.

Re: Welcome to America: Here's Your Linux Computer

#32

Post by the_af » Fri, Jun 05, 2015, 5:00 PM UTC

tdees40 wrote: post #26

lambda wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I have to admit I'm surprised to find that anyone is still trying to make desktop Linux work for normal people, i.e. non-programmers who aren't free-software fanatics. As far as day to day use goes, modern desktop Linux environments are just as usable by end users as Windows. The main impediments to adoption tend to be: 1. Software that they need that only runs on Windows or OS X 2. Syncing to devices like iPods or…

"Just as usable by end users as Windows." Have you seen a non-programmer install a printer on a Linux machine? It's terrifying.

At least as of version 12.04, Ubuntu [1] automagically detects my wireless HP Laserjet printer (albeit with some slightly reduced functionality, IIRC). My wife's Windows 7 laptop struggles with it; the install process was more involved and the printer sometimes refuses to wake up when sending a print job to it.

[1] The modern desktop-oriented distro I'm more familiar with. I'm sure other user-friendly distros handle it similarly well.

Re: Welcome to America: Here's Your Linux Computer

#33

Post by WorldWideWayne » Fri, Jun 05, 2015, 5:02 PM UTC

kenrikm wrote: post #17

w1ntermute wrote: post #2

It's good to know that you're providing Linux PCs to those who can't afford them, but let's be realistic - unless they turn out to be really interested in computers, as soon as the kids start working and get some money, they'll go out and buy the same shiny iDevices that all their peers covet.

~95% of the developers I know in the Bay Area use MacBook Pros. The underlying Unix base Apple runs on is nothing to scoff at and the majority of things someone learns about the command line on a linux machine will be the same on a OSX machine. I'm surprised you point out iDevices, what we should be worried about is keeping them away from the Windows ecosystem.

Apple is more dangerous to Unix culture than Microsoft ever was because the rate at which Apple screws it's own customers and developers is much, much higher than Microsoft.

OS X is also a sickly sweet gateway drug to living their iDevice lockdown lifestyle. They are continually doing things to lock down OS X with secret APIs that only Apple can use and that 95% you're talking about will one day figure out who Apple really is. I hope you enjoy being their sales-person until then!

Re: Welcome to America: Here's Your Linux Computer

#34

Post by hamburglar » Fri, Jun 05, 2015, 5:05 PM UTC

w1ntermute wrote: post #2

It's good to know that you're providing Linux PCs to those who can't afford them, but let's be realistic - unless they turn out to be really interested in computers, as soon as the kids start working and get some money, they'll go out and buy the same shiny iDevices that all their peers covet.

Nobody coveted the VIC-20 I spent all my free time playing with in elementary school, but it's basically responsible for my success. It's an opportunity, not a guarantee.

Re: Welcome to America: Here's Your Linux Computer

#35

Post by gkanapathy » Fri, Jun 05, 2015, 5:08 PM UTC

JustSomeNobody wrote: post #19

omarforgotpwd wrote: post #12

"Remember that shitty computer we got when we were first came to the US?" -- Kids, recounting this experience in 15 years

The CAME to the U.S., they weren't BORN here, so they don't have that ingrained elitist entitled attitude.

I came here and wasn't born here, older than those kids in the story. Fortunately I still managed to learn my elitist entitled attitude.

Re: Welcome to America: Here's Your Linux Computer

#36

Post by adricnet » Fri, Jun 05, 2015, 5:13 PM UTC

bad_user wrote: post #13

drzaiusapelord wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reminds me of the OLPC failure. Turns out cheap netbooks, the intel classmate, etc was what the market really wanted, not a top-down academia led turkey. We've been doing "here's a linux distro on some old windows hardware" for literally decades now. It just won't catch on, especially in the age of mobile where people want less technical hassles, not more. A cheap/used android tablet with a BT keyboard is probably th…

OLPC didn't fail because of Linux. And I for one am still looking for a durable and cheap netbook designed for small children, as I have a 5 year old son. He has access to an iPad, but besides games, there's nothing else it can do. I really wanted to buy an OLPC, except I couldn't find one, which btw has been the problem. Now I'm looking into buying a Chromebook and installing Linux on it. Only problem is that these…

Chromebooks are not fragile by laptop standards, but are nothing like XO.

You could try out one of these with a Bluetooth keyboard? They are somewhat sturdier than other tablets and have some OLPC-inspired software, plus whatever else for Android you can find. There are other Android kid-targeted tablets around, but they are all more expensive, afaik.

http://xotablet.com/

Re: Welcome to America: Here's Your Linux Computer

#37

Post by k__ » Fri, Jun 05, 2015, 5:16 PM UTC

radlad wrote: post #28

wyager wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Linux distros like mint are basically indistinguishable from Windows to sufficiently casual users. All they ever do is open up the word processor or browser.

This. I know plenty of people who literally cannot tell any sufficiently user friendly distro of Linux from Windows.

Yes.

The only people I heard complain about Linux were in the middle range of computer skills. Not so casual that they didn't care, but also not so good that they could easily grasp Linux.

Re: Welcome to America: Here's Your Linux Computer

#38

Post by psykovsky » Fri, Jun 05, 2015, 5:17 PM UTC

mwcampbell wrote: post #9

I have to admit I'm surprised to find that anyone is still trying to make desktop Linux work for normal people, i.e. non-programmers who aren't free-software fanatics. I think to myself, don't they realize that it's pointless, that the year of the Linux desktop will never come, that Linux will always be the distant third-place desktop OS? More constructively, I wonder if recent Linux distros and desktop environments…

You know how you make linux work? Never install pirated versions of any software on someone else's computer. When you start talking about how much they have to pay to use windows and office legally they'll change their mind and use whatever you put in there.

Re: Welcome to America: Here's Your Linux Computer

#39

Post by Zigurd » Fri, Jun 05, 2015, 5:21 PM UTC

mwcampbell wrote: post #9

I have to admit I'm surprised to find that anyone is still trying to make desktop Linux work for normal people, i.e. non-programmers who aren't free-software fanatics. I think to myself, don't they realize that it's pointless, that the year of the Linux desktop will never come, that Linux will always be the distant third-place desktop OS? More constructively, I wonder if recent Linux distros and desktop environments…

> ...normal people, i.e. non-programmers who aren't free-software fanatics.

Those people are not replacing their PCs. They are buying mobile devices. PC sales have been in a multi-year decline, and sell at about one-fourth to one-third the rate of mobile devices.

Re: Welcome to America: Here's Your Linux Computer

#40

Post by bdcravens » Fri, Jun 05, 2015, 5:24 PM UTC

omarforgotpwd wrote: post #12

"Remember that shitty computer we got when we were first came to the US?" -- Kids, recounting this experience in 15 years

I'm typing on the highest end MBPr you can buy, but my first computer was a 286 with DOS and a handful of programs - this was just after Windows 95 came out, so it was quite shitty for the day. However, no computer has been quite as magical as that one. While I get paid good money to produce code every day, and I think it's damn good code, I don't feel nearly as productive as I did when I was learning to write QBasic and batch scripts for the first time.