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Thunderbolt 3 embraces USB Type-C connector, doubles bandwidth to 40Gbps

arstechnica.co.uk

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Re: Thunderbolt 3 embraces USB Type-C connector, doubles bandwidth to 40Gbps

#31

Post by ZenoArrow »

Already__Taken wrote: post #21
ZenoArrow wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any word on whether the cables will be different? I suspect the cables will match, but the protocols the port support will be determined by the controller chipset.

I can't see how the cables will look much different between each other but even so they will all fit the same connector. There's already planned the 20gbps copper, 40gbps active copper and optical. What mechanism can stop the £0.99 charge only cables people expect to plug in their portable hard drives through.

> What mechanism can stop the £0.99 charge only cables people expect to plug in their portable hard drives though.

This has nothing to do with this Thunderbolt announcement, the situation would be the same even if only USB 3.1 was supported. However, the solutions are the same as ever:

1. Don't use charge only cables, buy cables that support charging and data. They're normally affordable.

2. Keep the charge only cable plugged in to your power source.

3. Mark the charge only cables with a sticker.

As for the Thunderbolt 3 announcement, it looks like there are three proposed cables, and it looks very likely that the passive and active versions will support both USB 3.1 and Thunderbolt 3. Perhaps the light based ones won't, but they'll be niche at first, unless Thunderbolt 3 takes off rapidly.

Re: Thunderbolt 3 embraces USB Type-C connector, doubles bandwidth to 40Gbps

#32

Post by orbitur »

stephen_g wrote: post #28

I'm interested in how backwards compatibility works - will old Thunderbolt devices work with just an adaptor cable? As someone who does a lot of professional video/audio work, I have a bunch of Thunderbolt devices so I hope that's the case.

This article ( http://www.theverge.com/2015/6/2/8704067/thunderbolt-3-usb-c... ) explicitly mentions an adapter for the older Thunderbolts. I assume the adapter would be passive.

Re: Thunderbolt 3 embraces USB Type-C connector, doubles bandwidth to 40Gbps

#33

Post by gutnor »

kcorbitt wrote: post #13
hjnilsson wrote: post #3

And finally, the future has arrived. If the iPhone 7 (doubt the 6S) sports USB-C as well, there will be a truly universal connector. Imagine screens, laptops, TVs, phones, mp3 players, docks, hard drives and toasters all using the same plug (well, maybe not the last one). There will be a painful time of transition until we are there, but hopefully it will be the last one. (Conveniently this also saves Apple on the ne…

On the balance, having one connector and hand-waving everything else as "it's all software" is probably better than the bewildering combination of ports and protocols we have now. But it will come with its own new and interesting issues as well. For example, when can/can't you plug your USB-C webcam into your USB-C monitor and expect your computer to detect it? If I plug my USB-C toaster into a USB-C computer, will i…

That's already the case with USB ( and to some extend Bluetooth and NFC )

What do you get when you plug you USB phone in your USB computer ? What about the tablet ? Why can I read files from my phone via USB but my phone can't read file from my USB HDD ?

Why is my Bluetooth headphone mono with the computer, but stereo with the phone. Why can's my NFC yubikey work with my NFC phone.

Right now, people mostly ignore it because there is generally broad support in devices provided by manageable number of generic protocols. So you mostly only have to care about the few cases when stuff don't work rather than thinking what works.

There is no reason to be overly pessimistic about USB-C, it is an incremental improvement over technologies already suffering from the same issue.

Re: Thunderbolt 3 embraces USB Type-C connector, doubles bandwidth to 40Gbps

#34

Post by snarfy »

The USB C connector is awesome and this is great news.

I still wish the industry would have standardized on the 2.5mm jack. It can be plugged in any direction. You could pull a cord out of a mess of cables and it would not snag as there is nothing to snag on.

Re: Thunderbolt 3 embraces USB Type-C connector, doubles bandwidth to 40Gbps

#35

Post by lectrick »

izacus wrote: post #14

Hmm, I don't understand the description fully - does that mean that it can happen that I can get a device with USB-C plug, plug it into computer and it won't work because the device uses Thunderbolt 3 and the computer isn't an Apple? Or will all Thunderbolt 3 devices be able to scale back and communicate with devices over USB if the controller is not available? How will that work with displays over USB-C connectors?…

For the record,

1) Apple was the first to use USB even though it wasn't an Apple tech

2) Apple was the first to use Thunderbolt even though it wasn't an Apple tech

3) Apple is now the first to use USB 3 Type C (aka "USB-C") even though it wasn't an Apple tech (although rumor has it that Apple engineers had a lot of input on it)

The technology you're probably confusing it with is FireWire, which WAS Apple tech.

Re: Thunderbolt 3 embraces USB Type-C connector, doubles bandwidth to 40Gbps

#36

Post by izacus »

chisleu wrote: post #27
izacus wrote: post #14

Hmm, I don't understand the description fully - does that mean that it can happen that I can get a device with USB-C plug, plug it into computer and it won't work because the device uses Thunderbolt 3 and the computer isn't an Apple? Or will all Thunderbolt 3 devices be able to scale back and communicate with devices over USB if the controller is not available? How will that work with displays over USB-C connectors?…

Thunderbolt isn't an Apple interface, it is an Intel interface. They were the first to use it, because they picked the best and fastest interface to combine video with network, USB, firewire, etc into one cable. However, several other brands have caught on, including the Dell m3800 I bought recently.

I didn't mean to imply it's an Apple interface - but I haven't seen TB 2 in the wild anywhere else then MacBooks/iMacs and most Thunderbolt devices refused to work with Windows (at least as I tested on my rMBP) due to lack of drivers. I did not mean to cause confusion, I apologise.

Re: Thunderbolt 3 embraces USB Type-C connector, doubles bandwidth to 40Gbps

#37

Post by orbitur »

donatj wrote: post #17

When Thunderbolt was first released it caused a lot of confusion in my office for people with DisplayPort who couldn't hook up to Thunderbolt monitors, bought for them by our IT group that really didn't understand the difference. I see this problem coming on strong AGAIN with this. This port is just USB-C while this other port is USB-C and Thunderbolt... That sounds like a load of confusion waiting to happen.

I think the Apple TB Display is comparable here.

If you have a rare TB device, you're probably a professional, and yes, you'll need to ensure the TB logo is on the port. If it's an extremely common USB device, it'll work on any port, without exception.

The Apple Thunderbolt monitors are Apple's fault. There was no reason they couldn't have accepted a raw DisplayPort signal, but they still didn't.

Re: Thunderbolt 3 embraces USB Type-C connector, doubles bandwidth to 40Gbps

#38

Post by adlpz »

smhenderson wrote: post #16
jacobolus wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they can now have both USB A and USB C ports without it being weird I’m expecting them to kill off USB type A ports entirely on future laptops. We’ll see what happens to Magsafe, HDMI, and SD card slots. I wouldn’t be too surprised to see a Macbook Pro with 4–6 USB type C (Thunderbolt 3) ports, a headphone jack, and nothing else. > Imagine screens, laptops, TVs, phones, mp3 players, docks, hard drives and toasters…

I could even see them ditching the head phone jack eventually. I can't imagine it will be long before someone starts making USB C headphones.

I hope they don't do that, I don't want to go around with a DAC hanging off my headphones. And making them more expensive.

Re: Thunderbolt 3 embraces USB Type-C connector, doubles bandwidth to 40Gbps

#40

Post by izacus »

lectrick wrote: post #35
izacus wrote: post #14

Hmm, I don't understand the description fully - does that mean that it can happen that I can get a device with USB-C plug, plug it into computer and it won't work because the device uses Thunderbolt 3 and the computer isn't an Apple? Or will all Thunderbolt 3 devices be able to scale back and communicate with devices over USB if the controller is not available? How will that work with displays over USB-C connectors?…

For the record, 1) Apple was the first to use USB even though it wasn't an Apple tech 2) Apple was the first to use Thunderbolt even though it wasn't an Apple tech 3) Apple is now the first to use USB 3 Type C (aka "USB-C") even though it wasn't an Apple tech (although rumor has it that Apple engineers had a lot of input on it) The technology you're probably confusing it with is FireWire, which WAS Apple tech.

Hmm, I think you misunderstood my post - I did not mean to imply Thunderbolt is Apple tech, neither did I do so for USB-C. I'm not sure how FireWire is relevant here.
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