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Harvard Accused of Bias Against Asian-Americans

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Re: Harvard Accused of Bias Against Asian-Americans

#81

Post by bobcostas55 »

rayiner wrote: post #57
ChicagoBoy11 wrote: post #23

Harvard Accused of Bias Against Asian-American === Harvard Accused of Favoritism towards African-Americans/Latinos/etc. The former just has a sexy title. The latter we've known all along because these schools openly state that they embrace affirmative action. The matter of fact is that the school is incredibly strategic in how it makes its admissions decision, taking into account not only race, but geography, and a w…

That's not actually true. The majority of Harvard's class is white. Statistically, if they are biased against Asians, that seat is going to a white person, not a black or Hispanic person. The magnet school where I went to high school has median SAT scores comparable to one of the mid-level Ivies. They got rid of affirmative action. It is now 70% Asian. And that's without accepting any foreign or out of state students…

Whites are actually unaffected by affirmative action. The transfer is from Asians to blacks/Hispanics. Here's some hard data: http://www.princeton.edu/~tje/files/Opportunity%20Cost%20of%...

"White applicants would benefit very little by removing racial and ethnic preferences; the white acceptance rate would increase by roughly 0.5 percentage points."

Re: Harvard Accused of Bias Against Asian-Americans

#82

Post by protomyth »

perfTerm wrote: post #56
ChicagoBoy11 wrote: post #23

Harvard Accused of Bias Against Asian-American === Harvard Accused of Favoritism towards African-Americans/Latinos/etc. The former just has a sexy title. The latter we've known all along because these schools openly state that they embrace affirmative action. The matter of fact is that the school is incredibly strategic in how it makes its admissions decision, taking into account not only race, but geography, and a w…

I hate typing on my phone so I'll make this short. When it comes to companies, diversity is far better than having whatever the equivalent of "everyone looks the same and has the same SAT scores" so presumably it'd probably work to Harvard's benefit as well to encourage diversity whether mandated by law or not. There's been plenty of studies pointing to the positives of diversity. In order to foster an environment wh…

"The kid who just missed getting into Harvard because of their race is probably going to an awesome school and statistically is more likely to come from a pretty good place in the world. They'll be fine."

Or they kill themselves because their life goal is over or become bitter and hateful of others. Really hard to tell when you shatter someones dreams arbitrarily.

Re: Harvard Accused of Bias Against Asian-Americans

#83

Post by yid »

whybroke wrote: post #72

So if the Ivy league schools are not actually choosing the best students, wouldn't that mean that Ivy League graduates do worse after graduation than alumni form other schools that don't use the Holistic admission process? More simply, if the SAT is the perfect determinate for intelligence and energy, and success in life directly relates to intelligence and hard work then the SAT alone should be the prefect predictor…

> More simply, if the SAT is the perfect determinate for intelligence and energy

Nobody, including the College Board, has ever made a claim remotely close to this.

Re: Harvard Accused of Bias Against Asian-Americans

#84

Post by calbear81 »

shiven wrote: post #67
rayiner wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not actually true. The majority of Harvard's class is white. Statistically, if they are biased against Asians, that seat is going to a white person, not a black or Hispanic person. The magnet school where I went to high school has median SAT scores comparable to one of the mid-level Ivies. They got rid of affirmative action. It is now 70% Asian. And that's without accepting any foreign or out of state students…

That's the end result schools like Harvard are trying to avoid. Why? That is the worst kind of discrimination in my book. How is it my fault that I was born smart, worked hard to capitalize on my innate abities and then competed on a standardized test to perform better than folks who just happened to pop out of a different vagina or uterus? Nice way to fuck me for no fault of mine. For those saying not getting into H…

To the question of why, Harvard believes that standardized tests are simply one of many factors that should be taken into account when deciding on who to admit. In building a student class, they value diversity not of race but of backgrounds and experiences. Perhaps that correlates closely with race since much of our country's socio-economic divisions also fall along racial lines in many places.

As an Asian myself, perhaps the question that needs to be asked is if there is enough diversity in our upbringing to be well-rounded candidates for admissions to "elite" schools?

Re: Harvard Accused of Bias Against Asian-Americans

#85

Post by calbear81 »

protomyth wrote: post #82
perfTerm wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hate typing on my phone so I'll make this short. When it comes to companies, diversity is far better than having whatever the equivalent of "everyone looks the same and has the same SAT scores" so presumably it'd probably work to Harvard's benefit as well to encourage diversity whether mandated by law or not. There's been plenty of studies pointing to the positives of diversity. In order to foster an environment wh…

"The kid who just missed getting into Harvard because of their race is probably going to an awesome school and statistically is more likely to come from a pretty good place in the world. They'll be fine." Or they kill themselves because their life goal is over or become bitter and hateful of others. Really hard to tell when you shatter someones dreams arbitrarily.

If not getting into Harvard is something that would cause someone to kill themself, then that's probably a good sign that they should not have been admitted. I'm not trying to be mean but someone who can't handle rejection or have confidence in their ability to do well without getting into Harvard is not Harvard material.

Re: Harvard Accused of Bias Against Asian-Americans

#86

Post by Retric »

caseysoftware wrote: post #78
streptomycin wrote: post #41

Personally I'm not too concerned about this at the undergrad level. So you don't get into Harvard and you have to go to a state school or whatever, that's not really an impediment to your life and career unless you want to become a congressman or a supreme court justice or whatever. Where it does bother me is med school. I've seen several of my Asian friends who were just ridiculously obviously great applicants eithe…

> Personally I'm not too concerned about this at the undergrad level. But if you accept it here, why not accept it everywhere? Either race-based discrimination is bad and should never be done or acceptable in some cases. If it's bad, Harvard (and others) should stop immediately. End of story. If it's acceptable in "some cases" the next question is: Who determines those cases? And then: Are there a set of fixed criter…

Pick your battles.

Re: Harvard Accused of Bias Against Asian-Americans

#87

Post by notsony »

perfTerm wrote: post #56
ChicagoBoy11 wrote: post #23

Harvard Accused of Bias Against Asian-American === Harvard Accused of Favoritism towards African-Americans/Latinos/etc. The former just has a sexy title. The latter we've known all along because these schools openly state that they embrace affirmative action. The matter of fact is that the school is incredibly strategic in how it makes its admissions decision, taking into account not only race, but geography, and a w…

I hate typing on my phone so I'll make this short. When it comes to companies, diversity is far better than having whatever the equivalent of "everyone looks the same and has the same SAT scores" so presumably it'd probably work to Harvard's benefit as well to encourage diversity whether mandated by law or not. There's been plenty of studies pointing to the positives of diversity. In order to foster an environment wh…

> I hate typing on my phone so I'll make this short.

Have you considered getting the Blackberry Passport which features a physical keyboard which is also touch sensitive for swiping. I find the Passport quite interesting and it can also run Android apps.

Re: Harvard Accused of Bias Against Asian-Americans

#88

Post by marcos123 »

calbear81 wrote: post #85
protomyth wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"The kid who just missed getting into Harvard because of their race is probably going to an awesome school and statistically is more likely to come from a pretty good place in the world. They'll be fine." Or they kill themselves because their life goal is over or become bitter and hateful of others. Really hard to tell when you shatter someones dreams arbitrarily.

If not getting into Harvard is something that would cause someone to kill themself, then that's probably a good sign that they should not have been admitted. I'm not trying to be mean but someone who can't handle rejection or have confidence in their ability to do well without getting into Harvard is not Harvard material.

Yeah, there have been a couple comments in this thread with this kind of viewpoint; "How will I go on in life after all the opportunity cost of not getting into [insert high prestige school]".

I feel so sad for anyone that has such a futile outlook in life. Life is literally what you make it, not what some gatekeepers make of it for you.

Re: Harvard Accused of Bias Against Asian-Americans

#89

Post by octottoman »

mrowland wrote: post #73
octottoman wrote: post #46

I'm not even going to post this with my real account. I wonder if we'll even be able to have a discussion about this without me getting downvoted into oblivion. Asians have the highest GPAs and SAT scores, followed by whites, followed by Hispanics, followed by blacks. As such, blacks are given the benefit of the doubt, where as Asians are judged more harshly. Statistically, these groups have differing average IQs in…

There's evidence[1] that there's no difference in intelligence between races at a very young age, and that tested differences only emerge later. This suggests that the IQ differences seen later are a result of societal factors and not something innate. 1: http://scholar.harvard.edu/files/fryer/files/testing_for_rac...

That's interesting; I didn't know that. I should like to read that document in its entirety.
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