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Time-lapse map of unemployment rates by U.S. county during recession

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Re: Time-lapse map of unemployment rates by U.S. county during recession

#21

Post by jsm386 »

lallysingh wrote: post #17
lvecsey wrote: post #4

Did we really need those jobs in the first place? I don't mean whether each individual was benefiting from the income from his or her job. Collectively, were the jobs a net benefit or drag on the rest of us?

There was a NY times post here a little while ago showing the current unemployment rate broken down by age, gender, race, and education. Unsurprisingly, the difference in education was enormous. It's not too large a logical jump to say that some of the existing unskilled jobs were waiting for automated replacement. Well, that's one of two options I'm pondering. The other is that the economy's split into a very litera…

That's the direct link: http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2009/11/06/business/econo...

Re: Time-lapse map of unemployment rates by U.S. county during recession

#22

Post by anigbrowl »

lallysingh wrote: post #17
lvecsey wrote: post #4

Did we really need those jobs in the first place? I don't mean whether each individual was benefiting from the income from his or her job. Collectively, were the jobs a net benefit or drag on the rest of us?

There was a NY times post here a little while ago showing the current unemployment rate broken down by age, gender, race, and education. Unsurprisingly, the difference in education was enormous. It's not too large a logical jump to say that some of the existing unskilled jobs were waiting for automated replacement. Well, that's one of two options I'm pondering. The other is that the economy's split into a very litera…

You make a very good point. I am often surprised when reading non-tech discussion boards about just how many people are still on dialup, or dislike ATM/debit cards, and so on. A lot of these people are distinctly hostile to new technology, feeling variously that it steals jobs or employs planned obsolescence to make them spend more.

While I think their worldview is fundamentally flawed, there are a lot of them, they're increasingly angry, and they vote. Just because they're on the internet doesn't mean they have the same kind of enthusiasm for technical progress that we do, far from it.

Re: Time-lapse map of unemployment rates by U.S. county during recession

#23

Post by jsm386 »

It is really interesting to watch how things were concentrated for the first 6 to 7 months of the recession, and then we fell off the cliff last fall. This chart is another great way of seeing how that happened: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_pMscxxELHEg/SsXzzDSUSqI/AAAAAAAAGf... (via http://www.calculatedriskblog.com/2009/10/october-economic-s...)

Re: Time-lapse map of unemployment rates by U.S. county during recession

#24

Post by bumblebird »

randallsquared wrote: post #16
bumblebird wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds very much like a "everyone for themselves" attitude to me. Which seems to be one of the bad things about the US.

Not at all. If those jobs were a net loss (and I have no idea about that), then finding something for those people to do which benefits everyone more is a win, both for "us" and "them".

Sure but thats an unattainable dream. Some people are always a drain on society. Either you leave them to die, or you give them a hand.

Re: Time-lapse map of unemployment rates by U.S. county during recession

#25

Post by slyn »

lallysingh wrote: post #17
lvecsey wrote: post #4

Did we really need those jobs in the first place? I don't mean whether each individual was benefiting from the income from his or her job. Collectively, were the jobs a net benefit or drag on the rest of us?

There was a NY times post here a little while ago showing the current unemployment rate broken down by age, gender, race, and education. Unsurprisingly, the difference in education was enormous. It's not too large a logical jump to say that some of the existing unskilled jobs were waiting for automated replacement. Well, that's one of two options I'm pondering. The other is that the economy's split into a very litera…

I don't think the unemployment divide has much to do with technology.

Imagine that the economy of every country in the world is a lake. The depth of the hole in which the water resides is roughly proportional to the population of a country, and the amount of water inside the hole is roughly proportional to the average persons quality of life in that country.

America has a relatively high water mark compared to the rest of the world. When America opened trade with China, we essentially dug a hole between our lake and their lake. Because China's lake has such a low water mark, water from our lake (jobs basically) will flow to their lake until their lake and our lake are roughly at equilibrium. Same goes for India and the rest of the world we trade with globally. The lowest water (lowest paying, lowest education req jobs) flows over first, which is why lots of the manufacturing and call center type jobs went overseas first. The current downturn was likely caused by things not related to this flow, but as the recession makes its way through the economy it increases the flow as companies look for ways to cut costs.

I would further the analogy but I don't really have time. End result is: More education = less likely to lose your job. What sector of the economy you are in has little to do with your actual job security.

Re: Time-lapse map of unemployment rates by U.S. county during recession

#26

Post by kiba »

philwelch wrote: post #20
japherwocky wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

well.. without jobs people can't pay for water/food/shelter, so yeah.. we need those jobs. Unless you want to throw in on the heating bill?

Without an income people can't pay for their living expenses. However, that doesn't mean the work those people are performing for that income is actually necessary to anyone else. The question is: through easy and cheap credit, was the economy paying a bunch of paychecks to some people in exchange for unnecessary labor? If I hire a guy to dig a hole in the morning and fill up the hole in the afternoon, the guy I hire…

Your comment made me recalled a quote of Frederic Bastiat.

"But if, on the other hand, you come to the conclusion, as is too often the case, that it is a good thing to break windows, that it causes money to circulate, and that the encouragement of industry in general will be the result of it, you will oblige me to call out, "Stop there! Your theory is confined to that which is seen; it takes no account of that which is not seen."

It is not seen that as our shopkeeper has spent six francs upon one thing, he cannot spend them upon another. It is not seen that if he had not had a window to replace, he would, perhaps, have replaced his old shoes, or added another book to his library. In short, he would have employed his six francs in some way which this accident has prevented.

Let us take a view of industry in general, as affected by this circumstance. The window being broken, the glazier's trade is encouraged to the amount of six francs: this is that which is seen.

If the window had not been broken, the shoemaker's trade (or some other) would have been encouraged to the amount of six francs: this is that which is not seen." - Frederic Bastiat

Re: Time-lapse map of unemployment rates by U.S. county during recession

#28

Post by potatolicious »

err0 wrote: post #6

This paints a pretty stark picture. Has any else noticed an increase in unsolicited calls from head hunters and job offers? I am wondering if it's me or a leading indicator?

A good friend of mine is still looking for a job after graduating from college - and he's been suckered into scammy pyramid scheme interviews already.

Seems like the vermin come out to play when the economy is bad.

Funny/sad part is that he got this lead from a posting on my college's alumni jobs system.

Re: Time-lapse map of unemployment rates by U.S. county during recession

#29

Post by blahedo »

A beautiful illustration of the extent to which choice and distribution of colour influences the interpretation of a graphic. The ominous rushing-in of the doom-and-gloom purples and greys was just about terrifying (ok, I exaggerate a little). Would this animation have had the same effect if scaled from e.g. blue to yellow?
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