Microsoft Edge: Building a safer browser • Hacker News Board

Re: Microsoft Edge: Building a safer browser

#41

Post by adventured » Tue, May 12, 2015, 1:50 AM UTC

haswell wrote: post #4

craigds wrote: post #3

> Microsoft Edge provides no support for VML, VB Script, Toolbars, BHOs, or ActiveX. Years too late of course, but good to see this finally happening.

This is definitely a case of "better late than never", IMO. Microsoft browsers will always have a foothold in enterprise environments, and the prospect of developing against a "real" browser when working with enterprise customers is rather exciting.

Microsoft ships their browser on 250-300 million new PCs and tablets every year, or roughly 200% more computing devices than in 1999. Most of those go to consumers. I'd say Microsoft will continue to have a foothold (of some scale) with consumers by default as well, even if it's just 10%-20% of PC/laptop/surface consumers that will use the Microsoft browser by default, that becomes a big installed base.

Re: Microsoft Edge: Building a safer browser

#42

Post by zobzu » Tue, May 12, 2015, 1:54 AM UTC

kid0m4n wrote: post #7

I believe that Microsoft not releasing versions for Linux / Mac OS X is going to not allow Edge to get maximum adoption. How am I supposed to test that my website works on Edge properly? The only option thus far is to setup a VM with Windows 10 on it so that I can run a browser to test my website. I dont even bother testing stuff on IE x for that reason.

I bet you're one of these only testing on chrome nowadays...

Re: Microsoft Edge: Building a safer browser

#43

Post by adventured » Tue, May 12, 2015, 1:56 AM UTC

Turing_Machine wrote: post #27

nivla wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For us techies, sure, but I wonder how many average joes have written off IE? For them the 'e' logo is and always have been the door to the internet. Now since Microsoft is planning on bundling both the new and the old browser in Win10, I am curious to see how many of these people will still stick with the old one over the new.

"I wonder how many average joes have written off IE?" Lots of them. Many surveys show it down in the Safari region, for instance: http://gs.statcounter.com/#all-browser-ww-monthly-201504-201...

More likely closer to 25% to 30%

Every other major source than that one reports IE well above 12%

http://www.zdnet.com/article/the-most-u-s-popular-web-browse...

https://www.netmarketshare.com/browser-market-share.aspx?qpr...

Re: Microsoft Edge: Building a safer browser

#44

Post by Turing_Machine » Tue, May 12, 2015, 1:59 AM UTC

adventured wrote: post #43

Turing_Machine wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I wonder how many average joes have written off IE?" Lots of them. Many surveys show it down in the Safari region, for instance: http://gs.statcounter.com/#all-browser-ww-monthly-201504-201...

More likely closer to 25% to 30% Every other major source than that one reports IE well above 12% http://www.zdnet.com/article/the-most-u-s-popular-web-browse... https://www.netmarketshare.com/browser-market-share.aspx?qpr...

The first one is limited to .gov websites, and lots of government agencies still use IE for internal use.

The second one excludes mobile, for no good reason that I can see. Mobile is huge.

Re: Microsoft Edge: Building a safer browser

#45

Post by JustSomeNobody » Tue, May 12, 2015, 2:05 AM UTC

jedberg wrote: post #5

Having met the engineers who actually built Edge, I can say with some confidence that I think this will the Microsoft browser people actually like. They built it from the ground up with security in mind, and with standards compatibility at the expense of backwards compatibility. In other words, they have finally decided that it is ok to tell their lagging enterprise customers to get with the times.

I thought they started with IE and cut out parts. That's not ground up.

Re: Microsoft Edge: Building a safer browser

#46

Post by velodrome » Tue, May 12, 2015, 2:10 AM UTC

ethana wrote: post #17

craigds wrote: post #3

> Microsoft Edge provides no support for VML, VB Script, Toolbars, BHOs, or ActiveX. Years too late of course, but good to see this finally happening.

There are people that swear by VB script. But new extension engine would be nice.

VBScript needs to die. Microsoft has been trying to kill anything VB-related for years. It's a zombie.

The guys who swear by it are not programmers. Sorry.

Re: Microsoft Edge: Building a safer browser

#47

Post by cantankerous » Tue, May 12, 2015, 2:11 AM UTC

Navarr wrote: post #29

craigds wrote: post #3

> Microsoft Edge provides no support for VML, VB Script, Toolbars, BHOs, or ActiveX. Years too late of course, but good to see this finally happening.

But you know, new Microsoft proprietary "Microsoft Passport" authentication stuff >|

Google has its own proprietary sign in features across its offering. I think it's becoming more or less standard fare.

Re: Microsoft Edge: Building a safer browser

#48

Post by kijin » Tue, May 12, 2015, 2:13 AM UTC

vinceyuan wrote: post #33

kijin wrote: post #18

A bit off topic, but I really hope that Microsoft and Samsung have reached some sort of understanding regarding the name "Edge". A trademark dispute involving their new browser is the last thing Microsoft needs at this time. It was confusing enough when they had to change SkyDrive to OneDrive.

I don't think it is a problem. The new browser's name is not Edge. It's 'Microsoft Edge'. The samsung phone's name is 'Galaxy Edge'. Now tech companies like to use the compound name, e.g. Apple Watch, to avoid the trademark issue.

SkyDrive was Microsoft SkyDrive too, but the British court ruled that it infringed BSkyB's trademark.

Re: Microsoft Edge: Building a safer browser

#49

Post by johnwfinigan » Tue, May 12, 2015, 2:16 AM UTC

"Microsoft Edge is also 64-bit, not just by default, but at all times when running on a 64-bit processor."

After 32-bit Windows Server went away as of 2008 R2, I didn't expect MS to keep shipping 32-bit client for this long. Anybody have a convincing argument as to why? 16-bit legacy apps in large businesses?

Obviously it's not free to do this, especially since they'll be producing every patch for two PC platforms for probably another decade.

Re: Microsoft Edge: Building a safer browser

#50

Post by Osiris » Tue, May 12, 2015, 2:33 AM UTC

JustSomeNobody wrote: post #45

jedberg wrote: post #5

Having met the engineers who actually built Edge, I can say with some confidence that I think this will the Microsoft browser people actually like. They built it from the ground up with security in mind, and with standards compatibility at the expense of backwards compatibility. In other words, they have finally decided that it is ok to tell their lagging enterprise customers to get with the times.

I thought they started with IE and cut out parts. That's not ground up.

> But Microsoft Edge has done more than just re-write the rendering engine...

> Microsoft Edge hosts a new rendering engine, Microsoft EdgeHTML

> The largest change in Microsoft Edge security is that the new browser is a Universal Windows app.

Everything they'd said in their press releases, including this one, says that the browser is a completely rewrite from scratch, though leveraging lessons learned on security.

edit: I stand corrected. Is there evidence that the application (Edge) itself is based on IE or just the rendering engine?