Game theory’s cure for corruption • Hacker News Board

Re: Game theory’s cure for corruption

#31

Post by spcoll » Mon, May 11, 2015, 5:35 PM UTC

Maultasche wrote: post #27

Have everyone empowered to dispense justice is an interesting proposition, but there's a big difference between insects and people. People aren't all logical, analytic creatures, especially when they operate in groups. They tend to act on emotion rather than logic and it often isn't clear which information is factual and which is rumor. People tend to be susceptible to groupthink, and often go with the crowd. Having…

> In reality, I would think that such a system would result in mob violence, sometimes triggered by good information, but often triggered by hearsay and rumors.

Basically what you see today on social media, where everyone is empowered to be an agent of "justice" (a public shaming and harassment-based justice system).

Re: Game theory’s cure for corruption

#32

Post by ashark » Mon, May 11, 2015, 5:37 PM UTC

hammeringtime wrote: post #4

" Imagine a city where police commit blatant traffic violations and never ticket one another. The authorities could decrease power inequalities by developing an online system in which all citizens are able to anonymously report dangerous drivers. Anyone who received too many independent reports would be investigated – police included. " This makes sense to me. It infuriates me as a biker and pedestrian when police da…

Even as another driver I automatically class any police car I see as "highest possible risk of doing something stupid without warning", right up there with a minivan full of kids and a texting driver that I've observed swerving several times and has changed lanes without signaling.

The only problem with this is that the cop car probably deserves a class of its own, even riskier than the swerving distracted-driver minivan full of kids.

Re: Game theory’s cure for corruption

#33

Post by javajosh » Mon, May 11, 2015, 5:41 PM UTC

lisper wrote: post #10

javajosh wrote: post #3

Can someone tl;dr this? I skimmed it but the florid prose and the lack of any, you know, concrete suggestion (that I could find) really, really put me off (and I'm normally a huge fan of aeon).

Game theory predicts that corruption is inevitable when only a subset of the population is empowered to enforce societal norms. Hence, the only way to eliminate corruption is by empowering all of the members of a society to enforce societal norms.

Thank you. I really like that idea!

Re: Game theory’s cure for corruption

#34

Post by backtoyoujim » Mon, May 11, 2015, 5:41 PM UTC

spcoll wrote: post #31

Maultasche wrote: post #27

Have everyone empowered to dispense justice is an interesting proposition, but there's a big difference between insects and people. People aren't all logical, analytic creatures, especially when they operate in groups. They tend to act on emotion rather than logic and it often isn't clear which information is factual and which is rumor. People tend to be susceptible to groupthink, and often go with the crowd. Having…

> In reality, I would think that such a system would result in mob violence, sometimes triggered by good information, but often triggered by hearsay and rumors. Basically what you see today on social media, where everyone is empowered to be an agent of "justice" (a public shaming and harassment-based justice system).

The Scarlet Twitter.

Re: Game theory’s cure for corruption

#35

Post by jmcmichael » Mon, May 11, 2015, 5:46 PM UTC

albertsun wrote: post #23

If your mental model for something is so malleable that it can explain cancer and police corruption the same way, maybe it's not actually providing any insight and all you've done is distort reality to fit it. Just saying... Game theory is so easy to invoke

On the other hand, many times deep principles can be discovered and validated when they reveal unusual correlations between previously unknown-to-be-related systems.

Re: Game theory’s cure for corruption

#36

Post by javajosh » Mon, May 11, 2015, 5:48 PM UTC

Maultasche wrote: post #27

Have everyone empowered to dispense justice is an interesting proposition, but there's a big difference between insects and people. People aren't all logical, analytic creatures, especially when they operate in groups. They tend to act on emotion rather than logic and it often isn't clear which information is factual and which is rumor. People tend to be susceptible to groupthink, and often go with the crowd. Having…

>If we had a system where a mass of people decided via some sort of upvoting/downvoting, it would be a "tyranny of the majority", where minorities would be oppressed...

Maybe. But isn't it an experiment worth trying? Does anyone really know what would happen in a modern, secular, money-driven society if you gave people more authority to enforce the law?

Re: Game theory’s cure for corruption

#37

Post by abecedarius » Mon, May 11, 2015, 5:49 PM UTC

We don't have to speculate about how widespread power of prosecution might work out; there's history. http://www.daviddfriedman.com/Academic/England_18thc./Englan... http://www.daviddfriedman.com/Academic/Iceland/Iceland.html

Re: Game theory’s cure for corruption

#38

Post by BuildTheRobots » Mon, May 11, 2015, 5:50 PM UTC

linhchi wrote: post #2

to be relevant, this same author writes a very interesting piece about pregnancy seen as a war of conflict between mom and infant http://aeon.co/magazine/science/pregnancy-is-a-battleground-...

That was a fantastic read -thank you :)

Re: Game theory’s cure for corruption

#39

Post by mod » Mon, May 11, 2015, 5:52 PM UTC

ashark wrote: post #32

hammeringtime wrote: post #4

" Imagine a city where police commit blatant traffic violations and never ticket one another. The authorities could decrease power inequalities by developing an online system in which all citizens are able to anonymously report dangerous drivers. Anyone who received too many independent reports would be investigated – police included. " This makes sense to me. It infuriates me as a biker and pedestrian when police da…

Even as another driver I automatically class any police car I see as "highest possible risk of doing something stupid without warning", right up there with a minivan full of kids and a texting driver that I've observed swerving several times and has changed lanes without signaling. The only problem with this is that the cop car probably deserves a class of its own, even riskier than the swerving distracted-driver min…

Maybe it's a function of me living in a small town, but I have only once seen police doing anything dangerous while driving. I've NEVER seen one use his siren to get through a red-light, either.

When they have the siren on, they're typically driving much faster than normal, but normally they're indistinguishable from a normal driver.

The one incident I did see was a motorcycle officer do a U-turn across four lanes to come ticket me (no seatbelt). He turned on his lights first, and the road was relatively clear.

Re: Game theory’s cure for corruption

#40

Post by _lce0 » Mon, May 11, 2015, 5:53 PM UTC

Maultasche wrote: post #27

Have everyone empowered to dispense justice is an interesting proposition, but there's a big difference between insects and people. People aren't all logical, analytic creatures, especially when they operate in groups. They tend to act on emotion rather than logic and it often isn't clear which information is factual and which is rumor. People tend to be susceptible to groupthink, and often go with the crowd. Having…

> If we had a system where a mass of people decided via some sort of upvoting/downvoting, it would be a "tyranny of the majority", where minorities would be oppressed...

I feel like, in tech, we have a bunch of those