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Apple's Mistake

paulgraham.com

41–50 of 285 posts

Re: Apple's Mistake

#41
>They treat iPhone apps the way they treat the music they sell through iTunes. Apple is the channel; they own the user;

Makes sense. I think it is not by chance that OSX is the least customizable OS around (and that's why my mac runs linux).

Re: Apple's Mistake

#42
post #4

Paul captured my whole feeling about the App Store matter, especially about buying Apple products. Now I feel like I'm doing something wrong. I still like the products but I no longer like the company. Today my small team of developers submitted the first "toy" we released just to test how the approval process works. Let's see if we'll have some bad experience as well.

Faustian bargain? Assholes? Evil? .. really, if this is the most serious accusation of "evil" one can level at Apple then it isn't really going to affect my buying decisions. It's not like they're dealing in small arms or manufacturing cluster bombs. If you step back and think about it all Apple is doing is stuffing up their own app store, which can be classified as monumentally stupid and short sighted but not really "evil".

Re: Apple's Mistake

#43
post #29

Though I can't marshall any evidence to support this claim, it was specifically not my impression that Apple was a company pro developers loved working with before the iPhone.

Fully agree. I recall in particular reading John Carmack a few years back talking about how he was glad Apple wasn't as dominant as Microsoft, because they were far harder to work with.

I wish I could remember the quote well enough to search accurately for it.

Re: Apple's Mistake

#44
post #39
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since the "1984 incident" I trust Amazon even less than I trust Apple. At least Apple doesn't yank music/apps/whatever off their customers' devices.

I suspect because it's difficult for them to technically do so. They would have pulled the GV Mobile app in an instant, if they could have, but the iPhone OS doesn't have this capability. The Kindle does.

Actually, they do have this capability, but they haven't used it.

Re: Apple's Mistake

#45
post #29

Though I can't marshall any evidence to support this claim, it was specifically not my impression that Apple was a company pro developers loved working with before the iPhone.

In high school, I thought that the CodeWarrior IDE (which was, as far as I knew, the dominant development environment) was absolutely terrible. I'm not sure how good my judgment at that time was. That said, with OS X they really became a lot more developer friendly just because they adopted a UNIX base. At this point, I'd say they're the default platform for ruby/web development. Look at all the rails job postings fo…

The relevant times under discussion are: the era of the Apple II which came with built-in Basic, and the era of post-OSX but pre-iPhone

Re: Apple's Mistake

#46
post #29

Though I can't marshall any evidence to support this claim, it was specifically not my impression that Apple was a company pro developers loved working with before the iPhone.

Yeah Cocoa dev was never took off if only b/c Macs used to be much more niche than they are today.

Re: Apple's Mistake

#47

1. While I agree with most developers that Apple has room for improvement, I think we should take a step back and realize how much of an improvement the iPhone has made mobile developers from a couple of years ago when the carriers were in charge of mobile applications. 2. I think the solution to the iPhone fiasco should be for Apple to hire more reviewers and allow developers to pay more money so that they can buy a…

1. A couple of years ago, I had a Windows Mobile phone and tonnes of applications. While it wasn't a great phone, it was a still a pretty good computing platform. A couple of years before that, I had an SE smartphone running Symbian which had fewer apps but was still open (I even developed a few). For smartphones, carriers were no more in charge of mobile applications then as they are now. In fact, in Apple's case, the carrier (AT&T) has more control than they do on blackberries or WinMo phones.

2. The review process is almost exponential, every week you have more apps and updates to all the existing apps. Maybe Apple is hiring more reviewers; they might have to just to keep up. Having a paid review tier just means that big developers get a 1 day turn around and indy developers get the left overs.

Re: Apple's Mistake

#48
I am about to show my ignorance of developing for the iPhone, so please forgive any incorrect assumptions and mistaken conclusions.

It is my understanding that apps can also be installed directly from third party websites... If so, is there a way to create an app for the App Store that is a shell to a website where a conglomerate of listings can be offered? It seems this would give the value of having everything fairly easy to find (one extra click) and yet get out from the management of the App Store for all but the original shell app...

Re: Apple's Mistake

#49
post #18
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I strongly disagree with your conclusion. Both smack of 'religious' thinking. Your point 1 is essentially 'be thankful to the merciful god who has ended the drought'. Your point 2 doesn't solve the problem, it just throws more priests at it. The solution is to open the platform to all developers. Imagine if Microsoft had vetted every DOS and Windows app, or if we had to submit Linux apps to Linus for review.

Imagine if Microsoft had vetted every DOS and Windows app Or, hold constant that Microsoft didn't vet DOS/Windows apps and imagine that every DOS/Windows machine had access to a cellular network owned by a some other company. I agree that the review process is completely broken, but I don't think the solution is as easy as having no controls whatsoever.

So you've never heard of Windows Mobile then?

Re: Apple's Mistake

#50
I disagree with the blanket statement that it doesn't work: for every 10 programmers who cant be bothered to create FOO app because of all the fuss there will be one who does because he can take some market share.

I agree in spirit the system is screwed - but Apple do have a hell of a lot of sway. They have the leading product and the huge customer base (and the cool factor). To a point they can dictate things (and I agree this is bad and we should stop them)

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