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25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

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Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#91

And 16-container ships create as much pollution as all the cars in the world. Perhaps these ships are softer targets to correct than tens of millions of cars? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1229857/How-1...

sure, lets shut down everything and go tribal

Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would mandatory smog checks never be politically feasible? They are not just a California-only thing.

In addition to having a fairly large libertarian-leaning contingent (especially in rural areas), people in Michigan tend to associate personal vehicles with "freedom" at a level probably unmatched anywhere in the country (if not the world).

Michigan is unusually conservative/libertarian. Its a shame children, the elderly, and those with lung conditions pay for this misguided philosophy with their health.

Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#93
post #28

What i allways ask myself is for example if someone has an old car which polutes more than a new one, what would polute more to buy a new one or to continue to use the old one. Because producing the new car releases a lot of polutants as well. I have never investigated this.

I would rather see a massive uptick in retrofitting newer engines into older cars; I've done it a couple of times on older Volvos (240-940 vintage) and other makes, after the engines got really tired. I'd imagine it's cheaper/easier to just manufacture better engines and ECMs than it is to manufacture new cars, and you get to keep cool old cars on the road.

Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#94
post #49

And 16-container ships create as much pollution as all the cars in the world. Perhaps these ships are softer targets to correct than tens of millions of cars? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1229857/How-1...

Ships are not usually found in the middle of cities.

As someone who lives next to the port of Oakland, allow me to say that ships are indeed an issue in urban environments, and they do cause large amounts of pollution. And besides the ships, there are usually a number of diesel trucks that are coming to ship goods to and from the port.

Recent state and federal regulations have made this less a problem.

Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#95
post #19

Here in Europe (well UK and Spain whee I have lived and owned a car) you need to get a check every year for older cars, and that includes an emissions test. Don't you get that in the States / Canada? (It would appear that the study was done in Canada). Saying that, go to many less developed country and the cars are far worse condition. My friend always used to claim that the environmental cost of producing a new car…

Not forgeting that for years official government advice (and tax breaks) was "buy diesal cars" which was wrong and is causing considerable death and illhealth and continued problems with air pollution.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-32512152

Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#96
This article would be more helpful with some historical context. At some point in the past, if all cars were equal, 90% of cars produced 90% of the pollution. Over time newer cars replaced most of the old ones, and now it's 25% of cars. But the overall amount of pollution has dropped too. A future clickbait headline will read "5% of cars cause 90% of the pollution!" and sound very alarming, but in fact that's a measure of progress in removing most of the remaining polluters.

Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#97
post #17

This is why we should move from mandatory emissions checks on all vehicles, to spot checks of the worst vehicles (but we'd need to get the police excited to run a test.)

You'd have to get everyone excited to allow those tests to be run. If you're spot checking the worst vehicles that will more than likely lead to a large proportion of checks occurring in low-income areas.

This is my biggest concern with emissions tests- it disproportionately affects lower income people. Not sure how to get around that, other than offering subsidies for them to upgrade/repair to a more efficient vehicle.

But as others have said, there is better low hanging fruit to go after rather than older cars.

Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#98
post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find carbureted vehicles the most bothersome (the exhaust stinks of fuel at city speeds), so I guess enforcing emissions standards wouldn't solve the problem (because of grandfathering/exceptions).

Yes, every time I'm behind or passed by a "classic" older car with carburetors, even one that has been restored and looks like new, I'm surprised by how clearly I can smell the exhaust. By contrast modern cars emit almost no detectable smell. Hard to belive that pre-1980s all cars had exhaust odor like that, I certainly don't remember it from my childhood.

I guess the average carbureted vehicle on the road today is being run by someone with the mindset that the engine should run great and develop lots of power. Back in the day more people would have set them up leaner.

Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#99
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a sad reflection on out throwaway economy. Obviously repairs are often a much cheaper option. Further cars limited lifespan so 1 new car could mean replacing 15 cars 1 year sooner.

You’re not counting labor costs, tracking down an issue with an older car can be seriously time consuming, and that time costs something like $75-100/hr. For instance, my fun car had a persistent miss that made it basically undrivable. It took me something like 20-30 hours to find the issues and fix them. I have OBD2 scanners (the real deal, not the toys), all the tools needed, and the ability to read the service man…

Most states limit the max outlay required before they give someone a pass. In some cases, a vehicle requiring repair expenditures over $450 may get a waiver from the state exempting it from further repairs regardless of test outcome.

You can see a lot of details here. http://www.rff.org/Documents/RFF-DP-99-23-REV.pdf Also, repairs often increase fuel economy so not only do city's become far more livable again the net cost is fairly low.

Re: 25% of Cars Cause 90% of Automobile Air Pollution

#100
post #2

Title should be: "25 Percent of Cars Cause 90 Percent of Vehicle Air Pollution"

That's more likely to mislead, because it implies a difference between 'Car' and 'Vehicle', and 'Vehicle' can include trains, ships, planes, etc. 25 percent of Automobiles Cause 90 Percent of [Automobile] Air Pollution.

Ok, we've changed to that. Thanks.
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