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FOAM: New JavaScript Framework by Google Engineers

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Re: FOAM: New JavaScript Framework by Google Engineers

#51
looking at the todo example, i was perplexed by the way templates are inlined through comments:

https://github.com/foam-framework/foam/blob/master/apps/todo...

it led me to discover that the full text of a function can be reflected through .toString() ...

i'm not sure i'd be happy to see this approach widely adopted though. it feels like a language hack, like maybe js needs a multiline literal string..

Re: FOAM: New JavaScript Framework by Google Engineers

#52
post #36

This is a bold take on a problem that a lot of people have written away as reinventing the wheel. But color me impressed! Unlike almost every other Javascript framework we've so far seen, FOAM makes the data model the primary entity in the system, which is a good idea. In the typical UI-driven development of web applications, the data model often gets modified without much thought and causes cascading complexity acro…

I'd love to see a mature app written this way (and I mean that genuinely, without sarcasm) and look at their project timeline, war stories, etc.

My gut feeling is that the 'frameworks are for prototypes, libraries are for production' camp is closest to the money, but (a) I have no actual data and (b) different approaches to frameworks will have different outcomes.

Re: FOAM: New JavaScript Framework by Google Engineers

#53
post #51

looking at the todo example, i was perplexed by the way templates are inlined through comments: https://github.com/foam-framework/foam/blob/master/apps/todo... it led me to discover that the full text of a function can be reflected through .toString() ... i'm not sure i'd be happy to see this approach widely adopted though. it feels like a language hack, like maybe js needs a multiline literal string..

In case this is not already widely known, ES6 has that:

    var multiline = `line 1
    line 2
    line 3`;

Re: FOAM: New JavaScript Framework by Google Engineers

#56
post #2

Doesn't seem to actually be by Google. Perhaps the title could be changed to "by a Google Engineer"?

I was at EmpireJS where this was announced and they said they had a team of Googlers working on it, and showed a few production Google apps built using it.

Re: FOAM: New JavaScript Framework by Google Engineers

#57

Oh boy, yet another JavaScript framework. Colored me unimpressed; angular, backbone, ember, angular 2.0, react, etc. I feel like they're just reinventing the same wheel with a different spin. I wish people would actually spend their time creating a really revolutionary "framework" instead, better yet a programming environment, which would redefine how we write web programs. I'm envisioning a way to create software, w…

I've been thinking about this as well. A visual and intuitive way of building software would make software and code as disposable as paper.

Do you want to help build a system that is universally distributed and allows creation by everybody? I want to build something that will allow every person to create software on their touch screens without having to fiddle with complex interfaces or text-based commands. Do you want to make this vision a reality?

Email me sethjgore@gmail.com.

Re: FOAM: New JavaScript Framework by Google Engineers

#58
post #36

This is a bold take on a problem that a lot of people have written away as reinventing the wheel. But color me impressed! Unlike almost every other Javascript framework we've so far seen, FOAM makes the data model the primary entity in the system, which is a good idea. In the typical UI-driven development of web applications, the data model often gets modified without much thought and causes cascading complexity acro…

I'd love to see a mature app written this way (and I mean that genuinely, without sarcasm) and look at their project timeline, war stories, etc. My gut feeling is that the 'frameworks are for prototypes, libraries are for production' camp is closest to the money, but (a) I have no actual data and (b) different approaches to frameworks will have different outcomes.

I think UI programming almost always need a framework than a library, under these definitions of Library and Framework: Library = independent objects and methods that your code invokes; Framework = entry point to the app, controls the event loop that calls your code, and lets you hook into its lifecycle methods.

Under that definition, ReactJS is strictly a framework. But we tend to look at it as a library since unlike other monolithic frameworks (Angular, Rails etc.), it is quite small, composes well, and is not overly prescriptive.

While I don't think FOAM is the next-big-thing in Javascript frameworks (that award goes to React's component model), I am happy to see it focusing on the primacy of the data-structure and recognizing that good code flows from a good data structure. We can already use that philosophy in React by ensuring all components are annotated with propTypes, using a statically typed language (TypeScript), and clearly defining the API schema using something like JSON Schema (http://spacetelescope.github.io/understanding-json-schema/ab...).

Re: FOAM: New JavaScript Framework by Google Engineers

#59
post #36

This is a bold take on a problem that a lot of people have written away as reinventing the wheel. But color me impressed! Unlike almost every other Javascript framework we've so far seen, FOAM makes the data model the primary entity in the system, which is a good idea. In the typical UI-driven development of web applications, the data model often gets modified without much thought and causes cascading complexity acro…

I'd love to see a mature app written this way (and I mean that genuinely, without sarcasm) and look at their project timeline, war stories, etc. My gut feeling is that the 'frameworks are for prototypes, libraries are for production' camp is closest to the money, but (a) I have no actual data and (b) different approaches to frameworks will have different outcomes.

Just compare number of well-known production apps written using React & Angular.

Re: FOAM: New JavaScript Framework by Google Engineers

#60
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd love to see a mature app written this way (and I mean that genuinely, without sarcasm) and look at their project timeline, war stories, etc. My gut feeling is that the 'frameworks are for prototypes, libraries are for production' camp is closest to the money, but (a) I have no actual data and (b) different approaches to frameworks will have different outcomes.

I think UI programming almost always need a framework than a library, under these definitions of Library and Framework: Library = independent objects and methods that your code invokes; Framework = entry point to the app, controls the event loop that calls your code, and lets you hook into its lifecycle methods. Under that definition, ReactJS is strictly a framework. But we tend to look at it as a library since unlik…

Actually it can be feasible and quite convenient to have control over the event loop yourself, this is what immediate mode ui libraries and computer games are doing, in a way facebook's flux architecture plus react facilitates that kind of UI programming for the browser.
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