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Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

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Re: Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

#151

Post by colechristensen »

mhurron wrote: post #142
AH4oFVbPT4f8 wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't agree with resigning. If you resign and are in the US, you give up the ability to file for unemployment. I would start cutting expenses and start looking for something new until that day comes.

If you're fired in the US you may not be able to get unemployment either.

To the contrary, you generally have to get fired to receive benefits unless you are quitting for exceptional reasons. To deny your unemployment claims after you've been fired or laid off, your employer has to dispute your claim and demonstrate serious conduct breaches while under oath. If you quit for general dissatisfaction, you're not covered.

http://employment.findlaw.com/losing-a-job/eligibility-for-u...

Re: Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

#152

Post by alistairSH »

mhurron wrote: post #142
AH4oFVbPT4f8 wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't agree with resigning. If you resign and are in the US, you give up the ability to file for unemployment. I would start cutting expenses and start looking for something new until that day comes.

If you're fired in the US you may not be able to get unemployment either.

Usually, that only applies if you were fired for misconduct. And in places where firing for any reason is grounds for denying unemployment, most companies won't fight an appeal.

Re: Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

#154

Post by fsk »

alistairSH wrote: post #152
mhurron wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're fired in the US you may not be able to get unemployment either.

Usually, that only applies if you were fired for misconduct. And in places where firing for any reason is grounds for denying unemployment, most companies won't fight an appeal.

Frequently, they will word it as a layoff instead of a firing for cause, to avoid the potential lawsuit. Some minimum-wage employers would do firings to avoid paying unemployment, but that isn't as common at the professional level.

Re: Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

#155

Post by kelukelugames »

semi-extrinsic wrote: post #131
EliRivers wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do not trust HR or legal. Oh God yes. Everything they do, everything , is about protecting the company. They will lie to you, they will screw you over, and anything you say to them will be used against you in some way.

I'm a little surprised that everyone is saying "avoid HR" (I have no experience with being on the wrong side of management or HR, yet). Can anyone comment on whether this is US specific or if it applies equally in western Europe?

Let's say you are a female employee and a college hire calls you a sexist term during a meeting. Then yes, by all means go to HR.

However, if your manager did something inappropriate in private then whose side do you think HR will take?

Re: Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

#156

Post by kelukelugames »

greenyoda wrote: post #107
kelukelugames wrote: post #62

1. Do not talk to anyone else in the company about this issue. Do not trust HR or legal. 2. Document everything. Write down the conversation you had with your boss word for word. Go do that right now. 3. Save proof of the violations. Save proof of you reporting it. Save your "excellent" job reports. It will be harder for them to justify firing an excellent employee. Realize that data loss prevention software will tel…

"4. Consult with an employment lawyer." Talking to an employment lawyer is a very good idea, since you may be getting fired in retaliation for reporting illegal activity: "the 'expert' turned out to be producing documents that are not in compliance with Federal law." You might have a case for a wrongful dismissal lawsuit, which could give you leverage to get a hefty severance payment to make the case (and adverse pub…

I'm so happy to see someone else recommend this book. :)

Re: Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

#157

Post by wpietri »

serve_yay wrote: post #132
hackuser wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Knowing it's over, do the minimum work. I strongly disagree with this step. Ensure your performance is exceptional, flawless, and that everyone sees it. It's hard to do, hard to keep focus and not slip when everyone else is misbehaving, but it pays off: 1) It keeps your hands clean. Others won't know the inside story of why you were let go; if they see you slacking, they will doubt your character and work ethic and…

I think this puts too much emphasis on what people will think at the place that is about to fire your ass. If it's coming, vamping won't save you, and it probably doesn't matter much what those people think, in either direction.

Almost all of my work has come through relationships built at previous jobs. And I also do a lot to help good people I've worked with in the past.

I definitely notice when somebody makes a strong, professional finish. Indeed, it's a great way to understand somebody's character. Everybody's nice and helpful on their first day at work. It's how people behave when there's no immediate reward at stake that tells me what they'll be like in future tough situations.

Re: Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

#158

Post by lordnacho »

Lots of good advice in here. My 2 cents:

1) Don't worry about the future. Unless your city is really, really small, there will be other work for data science people.

2) Don't worry about your record or questions about why you were let go. You can always plead politics. It's a big firm, and people know there's politics in there.

3) Don't focus on the boss. Your new boss doesn't want to hear that you're uncooperative. Just stick to the politics line (boss couldn't get the budget for our group, blah blah).

4) Why on earth would you be blackballed? People do not generally use their networks like this, save for the closest friends. Have you ever looked at LinkedIn? Every post is happy happy. Or anti corporate politics.

5) Definitely start looking for a new job. It won't be strange why you've suddenly got a lot of half days or sickies.

6) Get a lawyer. The angle with the boss violating policy could help you. Also lawyers are generally useful in confrontations.

Re: Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

#159

Post by kmonsen »

EliRivers wrote: post #65
kelukelugames wrote: post #62

1. Do not talk to anyone else in the company about this issue. Do not trust HR or legal. 2. Document everything. Write down the conversation you had with your boss word for word. Go do that right now. 3. Save proof of the violations. Save proof of you reporting it. Save your "excellent" job reports. It will be harder for them to justify firing an excellent employee. Realize that data loss prevention software will tel…

Do not trust HR or legal. Oh God yes. Everything they do, everything , is about protecting the company. They will lie to you, they will screw you over, and anything you say to them will be used against you in some way.

They also know the laws and the politics of the company much better than you so you are playing on their turf.

Re: Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

#160

Post by wpietri »

eranation wrote: post #146
hnnewguy wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "I know it sounds unpopular but this is the way people get promoted vs fired, kind of obvious, but many people still think that if "They do the right thing" that they are clear" We need more people to prioritize "doing the right thing" over "getting promoted", not fewer.

let me put it this way, I was doing the "doing the right thing" approach and it hurt me personally, yet I still try to do the right thing, but not via direct criticism, there is an art of how to convey improvement suggestions and feedback to your boss, in tl;dr it is say something good, say constructive criticism, end with something good, and do it all in private. I never encountered a criminal violation though, so I…

Yeah, I second that.

I used to think it was important to "tell the truth" by which I meant saying the things I thought were important to say. In the end, I recognized that was more about me and my feelings than anything.

Now my goal in bringing up some unpleasant but important thing is to make a difference. If I'm going to make a difference, saying the truth isn't the important thing. It's getting somebody to listen to the truth. That is definitely an art.

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