Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

news.ycombinator.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 198 posts

Re: Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

#61

Post by jfoutz »

Most companies provide nothing beyond verifying employment dates - start and end. Providing more opens them up to lawsuits. I didn't get hired at $NEW_PLACE because $OLD_PLACE told them i watched cat videos all day.

You're working for an organization that's broken. Perhaps someone can fix their legal and ethical problems, but fixing that is not data science. There's nothing wrong with letting people higher up know, so they can perhaps resolve the issues. But remember, it takes a long time to turn a big ship. if there's already a culture of willfully avoiding ethics and the law, thats a long long process. Do you want to spend your valuable time fighting that fight, or doing good work?

I'd start looking for a new place right now.

Re: Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

#62

Post by kelukelugames »

1. Do not talk to anyone else in the company about this issue. Do not trust HR or legal.

2. Document everything. Write down the conversation you had with your boss word for word. Go do that right now.

3. Save proof of the violations. Save proof of you reporting it. Save your "excellent" job reports. It will be harder for them to justify firing an excellent employee.

Realize that data loss prevention software will tell the company you saved the examples.

4. Consult with an employment lawyer. In fact, go see two or three.

5. This is the most important step. Find a new job. Pretend everything is okay so you don't come off as desperate.

Re: Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

#63

Post by pknerd »

In my last job I had faced similar situation. The HOD wanted to get rid of me to colleagues and higher-ups. Unlike you I did not hesitate termination. Once my dues were clear I wrote an email to entire department, HOD, HRM and CEO and shared everything. The end result, I felt satisfied and some other pals saved themselves by quitting themselves.

Moral of the story: Be Courageous. If you are skilled you will get a job anyway. Who knows someone from HN already has approached to you?

Re: Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

#64

Post by lukeschlather »

joshyeager wrote: post #57
nezumi wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I were in this position I would find the appropriate internal legal counsel and cc them on the email, including the words 'client attorney privileged and confidential' at the top. This affords some protection against discovery were the information to become relevant in legal proceedings. Taking that additional caution on behalf of the company shows professionalism on your part and will be appreciated by management…

An employee is not the client of a company's legal counsel. The company is the client. So there is no expectation of confidentiality. Copying their legal team might make them more likely to act on the problem. But it won't protect the employee.

You misunderstood. CC'ing the counsel is a gesture of good faith towards the company, insuring that the company is protected and emphasizing that you aren't looking to start legal action.

Re: Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

#65

Post by EliRivers »

kelukelugames wrote: post #62

1. Do not talk to anyone else in the company about this issue. Do not trust HR or legal. 2. Document everything. Write down the conversation you had with your boss word for word. Go do that right now. 3. Save proof of the violations. Save proof of you reporting it. Save your "excellent" job reports. It will be harder for them to justify firing an excellent employee. Realize that data loss prevention software will tel…

Do not trust HR or legal.

Oh God yes. Everything they do, everything, is about protecting the company. They will lie to you, they will screw you over, and anything you say to them will be used against you in some way.

Re: Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

#66

Post by Silhouette »

joshyeager wrote: post #57
nezumi wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I were in this position I would find the appropriate internal legal counsel and cc them on the email, including the words 'client attorney privileged and confidential' at the top. This affords some protection against discovery were the information to become relevant in legal proceedings. Taking that additional caution on behalf of the company shows professionalism on your part and will be appreciated by management…

An employee is not the client of a company's legal counsel. The company is the client. So there is no expectation of confidentiality. Copying their legal team might make them more likely to act on the problem. But it won't protect the employee.

I got the impression that nezumi knew that, and was suggesting the marking as a way of protecting the current employer, to demonstrate to any more senior management who might become involved that the OP is not just trying to make trouble.

Whether that would actually help here and whether such markings have any weight in whatever legal system the OP is operating within are different questions, of course.

Re: Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

#67

Post by baldfat »

fsk wrote: post #36

I've been unfairly fired several times, so my advice is: 1. Forget it, that job is over, it can't be salvaged. Knowing it's over, do the minimum work. 2. Start actively looking. Even if you don't find a new job within 30 days, you'll start getting interviews in your pipeline. 3. If it's so bad that it's making you sick (trouble sleeping, etc.), then just walk away now. Otherwise, there are advantages to saying on to…

I would counter. Don't get fired. If need be resign, but I would do everything I could to not be fired.

Secondly I have thought that I was doing a good job but I was viewed negatively. I later found out that an ounce of criticism or attitude ruined my whole perspective. I had to learn that one comment or one person didn't decide who liked me. I just rolled with the punches and talked to managers and other non-related co-workers if they saw things the same way, but without complaining or seeing myself as a negative fault finding Nancy.

Re: Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

#69

Post by fsk »

baldfat wrote: post #67
fsk wrote: post #36

I've been unfairly fired several times, so my advice is: 1. Forget it, that job is over, it can't be salvaged. Knowing it's over, do the minimum work. 2. Start actively looking. Even if you don't find a new job within 30 days, you'll start getting interviews in your pipeline. 3. If it's so bad that it's making you sick (trouble sleeping, etc.), then just walk away now. Otherwise, there are advantages to saying on to…

I would counter. Don't get fired. If need be resign, but I would do everything I could to not be fired. Secondly I have thought that I was doing a good job but I was viewed negatively. I later found out that an ounce of criticism or attitude ruined my whole perspective. I had to learn that one comment or one person didn't decide who liked me. I just rolled with the punches and talked to managers and other non-related…

Verbal criticism is one thing. Being put on a performance improvement plan (PIP) is another thing. Most of the time, your boss will only fill out a PIP as a precursor to firing you, because the bureaucracy requires it.

Re: Ask HN: I am about to be fired. What should I do?

#70

Post by kelukelugames »

throwaway426 wrote: post #4

> Do I quit before the period expires? If you're fairly certain you'll be fired (and it sounds like you are) wouldn't this be the most sensible solution? When asked in interviews why you left saying you quit usually goes over a lot better than saying you were fired. And explaining why you quit would certainly not be considered a poor reason - at least not for the companies you would want to work for.

In reality they will probably give him a choice: you can resign to save us the paperwork or we will fire you.
Post reply on HN