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Apple now rejecting apps with Pebble Smartwatch support

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Re: Apple now rejecting apps with Pebble Smartwatch support

#251

Post by justonepost »

cududa wrote: post #214
LordKano wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the kind of behavior that gets a company in trouble with the FTC. Indeed but Apple is aware that the FTC isn't likely to punish them enough that the behavior will be a net negative. If only the Federal Government would be as serious about "Sending a message" on antitrust as they are about low-mid level drug dealers, this kind of thing would be a lot more rare.

But Apple doesn't have anywhere near a monopoly on smart phones, so being anti-competitive is completely legal

Yep. This is the long and short of it. Apple is careful not to get monopolies which allows them to be as anti-competitive as they want. Not sure why this got downvoted. Typical HN..

Re: Apple now rejecting apps with Pebble Smartwatch support

#252

Post by mikeash »

clarky07 wrote: post #237
mikeash wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"By that logic" doesn't belong anywhere near a discussion of Apple review guidelines or behavior. The only thing they are consistent about when reviewing iOS apps is being completely inconsistent. You cannot point to the acceptance of one app as evidence that some rule isn't being applied to another app. Apple constantly rejects apps for claimed rule violations while allowing other apps through with identical violati…

Isn't that kind of the point. I had 4 apps with Pebble support (and noted in the description) approved in the last week, along with countless others as mentioned. This is more likely to be the bad/unlucky review than all the others. While it is another example of a bad review, it's not necessarily an example of a ridiculous new practice by Apple. Maybe it is maybe it isn't, but 1 app is far from proof.

You're right, but this is more or less what I was trying to address with the last part of my comment.

Yes, this is far from proof. But Apple has done stuff like this constantly since the iPhone SDK was first released. At some point, it becomes reasonable to stop giving them the benefit of the doubt, and assume that there's a good chance something bad is going on, just like the last thousand times.

If they roll it back, great! I imagine being called to task for a stupid decision will help make that happen.

Re: Apple now rejecting apps with Pebble Smartwatch support

#253

Post by freehunter »

blumkvist wrote: post #195
random28345 wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nowhere near... You're right, Apple is significantly worse. Microsoft went out of it's way to make sure that competitors applications didn't work (DOS isn't done until Lotus 123 won't run). This sparked a development arms race wasting hundreds of hours of development time working around intentional compatibility bugs. On the other hand, Apple sometimes just doesn't let your software run at all. No matter what. Beca…

It's about market share and global impact. It might sound like double standard to you, but denying your awesome new airbnb for dogs app is not quite the same as denying Java.

Which Apple does both of, so...?

Re: Apple now rejecting apps with Pebble Smartwatch support

#255

Post by mikeash »

toxican wrote: post #240
mikeash wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole point of my post is that if Apple were actively denying apps that support Pebble they would not necessarily have taken down the official Pebble app, because that sort of inconsistency is exactly how they operate. They can and do say "All apps that do X are forbidden" while not taking down some apps that clearly do X.

But when an app is the official embodiment of X, you'd really expect that to go first. If Apple were actively trying to get rid of Pebble-friendly apps, I would think the main/official Pebble app would be first to go. None of this really matters though because the title/claim are still bogus.

I wouldn't expect anything except inconsistency.

Apple does not move quickly, or consistently, or sanely. The continued presence of the official Pebble app on the store is completely consistent with a new Apple policy of prohibiting apps that talk about Pebble. Apple often starts by simply rejecting updates, and the Pebble app hasn't been updated since February. When Apple does start going after existing app versions, it often takes weeks or months. For example, there were several stories from the past fall about apps that came up with novel uses for the new Today screen in iOS 8, submitted, got accepted, were in the store for a month or two, then were suddenly given the choice of removing the feature or being yanked because it turns out that they were going against the arbitrary rules about what you're allowed to do in a Today widget.

Re: Apple now rejecting apps with Pebble Smartwatch support

#256

Post by mikeash »

s73v3r wrote: post #241
jasonlotito wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This comment is far more true than people realize. And the worst part is, it's not an exaggeration in the slightest. > You cannot point to the acceptance of one app as evidence that some rule isn't being applied to another app. This is something they won't even discuss if you question how other apps can have some feature they may not like. You could have the same exact feature, and you'll get rejected.

Because someone else breaking the rules is no excuse for you breaking the rules. It's like when you were a kid, and you tried to say, "But Johnny's doing it!".

Yeah, but when you don't think you're actually breaking the rules, "you never did anything about that guy" is good support.

This is not a case of somebody breaking the rules and trying to say that the rules do not apply. This is a case of the rules suddenly being reinterpreted to mean something completely different from what they used to mean.

Imagine if you stepped on a worm and then got arrested for murder. Would it not be a reasonable thing to say, "uh, there's another guy stepping on worms right over there and you're not arresting him, so what gives?"

Re: Apple now rejecting apps with Pebble Smartwatch support

#257

Post by nilliams »

31reasons wrote: post #235
Artemis2 wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel that Google/Apple should have been hit with an antitrust policy already some time ago.

I am curious why would Google be in trouble with antitrust ?

The EU announced antitrust charges against Google a couple of weeks ago [1]. tl;dr - '[T]he company has given an unfair advantage to its own comparison shopping service ...'

[1] http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/apr/14/european-c...

Re: Apple now rejecting apps with Pebble Smartwatch support

#258

Post by mikeash »

justizin wrote: post #222
bentcorner wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do we know how the app approval process works internally? I've never been involved with iOS, but from the various articles I've read, it sounds like there is a large team involved with approvals, their process is largely manual, their internal documentation is lacking, and they're probably missing simple things like checklists.

I suspect there are vague instructions preferred over hard-and-fast guidelines that can be leaked to the press and quoted in hearings.

For an example of something similar: when one of these rejection snafus ends up making a public spectacle to the point where Apple wants to work directly with the app developer, they will do so exclusively over the phone rather than in a more sane fashion like e-mail, so that the details can't be so easily recorded and spread around.

Re: Apple now rejecting apps with Pebble Smartwatch support

#260

Post by bzbarsky »

blumkvist wrote: post #248
atomicfiredoll wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's about market share and global impact There's not some kind of, "the impact has to be as large as when company X did it" rule. Apple now has enough market share, especially in mobile, that the global impact is troubling.

I don't know what rules you're talking about here. The OP says that Apple has worse practices than MSFT. I say that's not true. Denying computing technology on which business, governments, factories, powerplants, etc. run is FAR worse than denying (objectively) useless apps. When has Apple hindered a break-through technology? PS: I'm a massive fan of Microsoft marketing and strategy and have owned a grand total of 1…

> When has Apple hindered a break-through technology?

Contemporary example: it's impossible (as in, disallowed by Apple's policies) to install a web browser with a rendering engine written in a memory-safe language on your iDevice.

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