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Recycling in America

economist.com

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Re: Recycling in America

#51

Post by ryandrake »

mikeash wrote: post #32
Hobotron1 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps someone better versed in economics can help me here: isn't this the type of thing where a tax might be useful- for example, a tax on products that use 'new' plastic/glass as opposed to recycled? basically, convert the 'cost' of garbage everywhere into an actual cost?

I don't think it's necessary, because people already pay to dispose of garbage. The cost isn't borne by the manufacturer, but as long as it's borne by somebody involved in the transaction, it'll be accounted for. Taxes are useful to capture externalities, where the costs imposed are on other people unrelated to the transaction. For example, taxing air pollution helps to capture the costs it imposes on the general pop…

Problem is, people paying to dispose of garbage are not paying the entire environmental cost of the growing landfill. They're just (barely) paying the operational cost of transporting their junk to the landfill. In a perfect world, your garbage bill would include the total environmental impact of your choice to use and throw away disposable products. Until the "throw it away" lifestyle hits people's wallets, it's not going to change.

Quantifying that cost is a challenge--maybe start with how much $$ it would take to "un-product" the product and return it back to the raw materials it came from. In some cases, we'd find it probably costs more to un-make a product than it was sold for.

Could also (in addition to, or instead of) charge the MANUFACTURER for a portion of this shared environmental cost, as they ultimately chose to make a product designed to be turned into pollution.

Re: Recycling in America

#52

Post by steamy »

fake44637 wrote: post #49
steamy wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you go for the route of punishment (taxes) and not try positive reinforcement instead like incentives and or tax breaks?

Or a mix of both: start charging (more) for waste disposal but make recycling pickup free.

I'm no big fan of taxes and big govt.

Re: Recycling in America

#53

Post by mikeash »

ryandrake wrote: post #51
mikeash wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it's necessary, because people already pay to dispose of garbage. The cost isn't borne by the manufacturer, but as long as it's borne by somebody involved in the transaction, it'll be accounted for. Taxes are useful to capture externalities, where the costs imposed are on other people unrelated to the transaction. For example, taxing air pollution helps to capture the costs it imposes on the general pop…

Problem is, people paying to dispose of garbage are not paying the entire environmental cost of the growing landfill. They're just (barely) paying the operational cost of transporting their junk to the landfill. In a perfect world, your garbage bill would include the total environmental impact of your choice to use and throw away disposable products. Until the "throw it away" lifestyle hits people's wallets, it's not…

That's a good point. I think the best approach there would be to tax the landfills themselves.

I wouldn't want to put a tax on the manufacturers, because you'll end up discouraging reuse. You don't want somebody who comes up with a novel way of using old Coke bottles to pay the same as somebody who just pitches them.

Re: Recycling in America

#54

Post by ianmcgowan »

CPLX wrote: post #5

On a side note, I am consistently reminded of the extraordinary skill level the staff of The Economist employs when writing photo captions and article headlines.

Perhaps it's the most fun part when writing about somewhat dry topics? "Dutch asylum policy - Bed, bath, and begone"

Re: Recycling in America

#55

Post by ginko »

hn_ wrote: post #14
philfrasty wrote: post #3

Will never forget how I (German) walked into a Safeway in San Francisco with my bag full of bottles and asked the cashier where the deposit-machine is. She had absolutely no clue what I was talking about.

East Coast has reverse vending machines (bottle deposit machines) to put the bottles in. It reads the barcode - at least all places I've even lived in the East have them. When I was in California visiting family we had to go to a recycling center to get them weighed. The policies are regional. I like California's policy so much better cause I buy a lot of beer that gets rejected in the reverse vending machines.

>I like California's policy so much better cause I buy a lot of beer that gets rejected in the reverse vending machines.

The problem with the recycling centers is that you pretty much need a car to return them. With in-store machines you can just bring the bottles with you when you go grocery shopping.

Re: Recycling in America

#56

Post by youngtaff »

Hobotron1 wrote: post #21
ams6110 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would believe it. If the problem really is a supply/demand imbalance, the market should correct it. But nobody will pay me for my used plastic bottles.

Perhaps someone better versed in economics can help me here: isn't this the type of thing where a tax might be useful- for example, a tax on products that use 'new' plastic/glass as opposed to recycled? basically, convert the 'cost' of garbage everywhere into an actual cost?

In the UK we have a landfill tax in an attempt to drive up recycling rates which alongside kerb collection of recyclables has worked

Unfortunately it's also leading to local government approving incinerators for other types of rubbish

Re: Recycling in America

#57

Post by Hobotron1 »

steamy wrote: post #40
Hobotron1 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps someone better versed in economics can help me here: isn't this the type of thing where a tax might be useful- for example, a tax on products that use 'new' plastic/glass as opposed to recycled? basically, convert the 'cost' of garbage everywhere into an actual cost?

Why do you go for the route of punishment (taxes) and not try positive reinforcement instead like incentives and or tax breaks?

I'm a homeless vagabot, and included the caveat that I'm not well versed in economics, so the glut of options wasn't apparent to me.

Re: Recycling in America

#58

Post by gregsq »

jobu wrote: post #6

"Most recycled materials should be cheaper than virgin commodities" Surprisingly this just isn't true. It takes a lot of work and chemicals to clean inks and glues out of paper for recycling. Penn & Teller looked into this in an episode of Bullshit! a while back - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rExEVZlQia4 Aluminum and clear glass are very efficient to recycle, plastics and colored glass depend on commodity prices,…

This is one of the reasons we have seperate collection bags for recyclable materials in the UK for households. We don't have the benefit of landfill space, and it's economically more efficient to seperate paper, glass, metals and other potentially recyclable materials at source, than at a post process stage. The resident has two bins side by side, and sorts at source.

Re: Recycling in America

#59

Post by youngtaff »

ars wrote: post #36

America doesn't recycle more because it just isn't worth it to recycle things (except for metal). (And if you notice, this article, like most of them, talks about how it's worth it to recycling aluminum, and doesn't mention anything else.) You can tell that metal is worth recycling because you have people driving around looking for metal scrap and taking it. No one takes plastic. Cleaning, and sorting, plastic and pa…

Recycled glass can be added to tarmac to make it more hardwearing

Re: Recycling in America

#60

Post by jbob2000 »

hn_ wrote: post #33
Errorcod3 wrote: post #2

America is way behind from living overseas for 3 years. I have to pay extra to recycle, which I do not think is correct. Should be more like some areas in Germany where you pay for the amount of trash you have(weight), the more you throw away the more you pay -> encourages recycling! I also work for a brewery and it is sad that none will re-use bottles in the united states, all beer goes into brand new bottles :(

"American" is not one place. Many, many cities have policies just as you described - pay by usage. Many cities have free recycling. It is going to be different for every single city/town. My garbage is picked up by a private company unfortunately. That means my landlord only pays them to pick up garbage, not recycling. The town picks up recycling for individual households for free but my complex has private dumpsters…

That's the problem; that America is not one place. The fundamental setup of the country means that they can't get anything done as a whole, unless its at the federal level.
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