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1.5 Million Missing Black Men

nytimes.com

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Re: 1.5 Million Missing Black Men

#101

Post by Lawtonfogle »

[deleted] wrote: post #62
dmix wrote: post #13

> The black women left behind find that potential partners of the same race are scarce, while men, who face an abundant supply of potential mates, don’t need to compete as hard to find one. As a result, Mr. Charles said, “men seem less likely to commit to romantic relationships, or to work hard to maintain them.” Interesting, I never thought about this side-effect of mass incarceration. Another aggravating factor in…

[deleted]

Two issues.

First, the point could be: I'm curious if stable relationships with the gender they find attractive really do lead to less violence/crime by males?.

Second, there are significant differences in the brains of heterosexual and homosexual men (one of the points made by those saying it was not a choice). These could mean that the above point only applies to heterosexual men.

Re: 1.5 Million Missing Black Men

#102

Post by AlisdairO »

zoner wrote: post #58

Black women are unapproachable. Not sure why is that. Are white males not attractive in black women eyes? The effect is the reverse with white women as they tend to flirt with black man, hence the interracial children are mostly from black males and white females. I don't have a study to support this, but I do have personal experience.

Counterpoint: OK Cupid ratings appear to show that black men suffer rather less in the attractiveness stakes vs black women. http://blog.okcupid.com/index.php/race-attraction-2009-2014/ . If you see more black men + white women combos, those statistics would seem to suggest that it's because (for whatever reason) white men aren't as interested in black women as white women are in black men.

Re: 1.5 Million Missing Black Men

#103

Post by Someone1234 »

tomjen3 wrote: post #82
Someone1234 wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your offense is of no concern to me. The stats back up that people prefer to date within their own race when they can. Ultimately I am just arguing that people's choice is important to the whole topic, if black women would prefer to date black men, pointing out that they could date white or asian men won't help the situation.

Actually you are wrong in this specific case. Okcupid has the data ( http://blog.okcupid.com/index.php/your-race-affects-whether-... ) which shows that black women are more likely to reply to men now of her own race (and white men are almost at the top).

Let me remind you what I said verbatim:

> The stats back up that people prefer to date within their own race when they can.

That's exactly what your data shows. If you look across all races, there is a clear bias towards people dating their own race. You can find exceptions, but those are within one or two data points, and the trend overall remains true.

> which shows that black women are more likely to reply to men now of her own race (and white men are almost at the top).

By just 2 points. And black men prefer black women. You did find an exception, but keep looking and the trend maintains.

Also, quick reminder that my original post focused on personal choice being important. Nobody suggesting forcing people to date a certain race, just that personal choice might get in the way of the "solution" to the problem the OP suggested (inter-racial marriage).

Re: 1.5 Million Missing Black Men

#104

Post by dmix »

foldr wrote: post #56
dmix wrote: post #13

> The black women left behind find that potential partners of the same race are scarce, while men, who face an abundant supply of potential mates, don’t need to compete as hard to find one. As a result, Mr. Charles said, “men seem less likely to commit to romantic relationships, or to work hard to maintain them.” Interesting, I never thought about this side-effect of mass incarceration. Another aggravating factor in…

>many middle eastern countries I'd be careful of generalizing across such a diverse region. Isn't it actually a fairly small minority of countries in the Middle East that "generate [lots] of young angry jihadists"?

Most of the 18 countries considered part of the middle east have outputted their share of young men - especially if you rank the countries by population. And a significant percentage of Al-Qaeda in Afghanistan and Pakistan were foreign fighters from middle eastern countries not central asia, particularly the leading figures. I believe most people on HN are aware extremists represent a small percentage of the total populations.

Re: 1.5 Million Missing Black Men

#105

Post by ck2 »

Want some interesting perspective - in 1968 Jim Crow laws were still in effect (aka separate but "equal") until they were finally made illegal.

But you can be positive that just making it illegal in 1968 didn't end the practice, it most certainly went on into the 70s

That's only a couple of generations ago.

It's crazy that some people don't understand why it take so long to recover from hundreds of years of that, people of color were literally second class citizens.

Re: 1.5 Million Missing Black Men

#106

Post by baddox »

infruset wrote: post #40
Someone1234 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interracial marriage only works as a "solution" if there were an inverse imbalance in other racial communities to supply the men needed to fulfil the shortfall. It also completely ignores the fact that people in the black communities may not wish to date people from other races. it isn't a breading farm after all, people's choices matter a lot. If black woman want to date a black man, that is completely normal/unders…

You are starting from the assumption that it is normal that people date inside of their "race". This is an assumption that is very often made by Hollywood movies and which I find offensive, all the more because it is self-fulfilling: if you only see people of the same skin color dating one another, you're probably less likely to imagine yourself outside of the norm you perceive.

> You are starting from the assumption that it is normal that people date inside of their "race".

I think that claim is sufficiently substantiated that it ought not be called an "assumption."

Re: 1.5 Million Missing Black Men

#107

Post by subsection1h »

Mizza wrote: post #47
dmix wrote: post #13

> The black women left behind find that potential partners of the same race are scarce, while men, who face an abundant supply of potential mates, don’t need to compete as hard to find one. As a result, Mr. Charles said, “men seem less likely to commit to romantic relationships, or to work hard to maintain them.” Interesting, I never thought about this side-effect of mass incarceration. Another aggravating factor in…

> women are arguably less war-prone than men I don't think are actually any studies that support this, unfortunately. War simply isn't a consequence of gender, it is a consequence of ideology and fear.

All of the relevant poll results that I could find at PollingReport.com[1][2] indicate that women are less likely than men to support war.

[1] http://www.pollingreport.com/iraq17.htm

[2] http://www.pollingreport.com/iraq18.htm

Re: 1.5 Million Missing Black Men

#108

Post by javert »

kaa2102 wrote: post #20

I'm a Black Man. Growing up there was a realization that being alive and out of trouble over the age of 21 was an accomplishment. This would extend to middle class. Due to a history of American apartheid, there were often just a few degrees of separation between middle class and working/poor class kin.

In the US we had segregation, not apartheid. There is a difference.

As a white man living in the South, we still have segregation in practice. I rarely had interaction with blacks because they did different things and took different classes at school. We all went to the same schools---just didn't have the same classes or have the same social circles. Not much shared in the way of culture. I have had some black friends over the years who get berated by other blacks for "acting white."

There is nothing white people can do to fix this. Blacks have always decided what kind of culture they want to have and they will continue to do so.

Re: 1.5 Million Missing Black Men

#109

Post by chrischen »

chaostheory wrote: post #36
dataker wrote: post #19

Will this have an effect on U.S diversity ? In a way, it may foster more interracial relationships on affected areas

I can't find the study to cite, but if I remember correctly an old study found that while most males of all ethnicities are open to relationships with females of different ethnicities given attractive qualities are sufficient (I could be wrong but only physical attraction was measured in this study); they found that most females tend to only go for males within their own ethnic group. The exception was Asian women wi…

In Asian culture Asian woman always have a strong preference for other Asians (this is of course generalizing across the different Asian cultures), especially from the same Asian race. But there's a strong fetishizing of Asian women by certain non-Asian men so there's a disproportionate amount of Asian-women-chasing by white men that gets misconstrued as preference by Asian women. If everyone preferred blue M&Ms, you'll simply see more blue M&Ms in everyone's mouths, regardless of their race.

The Asian women fetish is quite unique in that there's really nothing else like it for women of another race present in American culture. You'll find it in pop culture such as Weezer's album "Pinkerton," named after the character from Madame butterfly who marries a Japanese woman.

Re: 1.5 Million Missing Black Men

#110

Post by hn_ »

brandonmenc wrote: post #55
Someone1234 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interracial marriage only works as a "solution" if there were an inverse imbalance in other racial communities to supply the men needed to fulfil the shortfall. It also completely ignores the fact that people in the black communities may not wish to date people from other races. it isn't a breading farm after all, people's choices matter a lot. If black woman want to date a black man, that is completely normal/unders…

> It also completely ignores the fact that people in the black communities may not wish to date people from other races. I think it's more the other way around. My observation, and I believe this is backed up by research, is that black women are more willing to date outside their race than other races are willing to date black women. But yeah, people generally date within their race.

I got curious and did a real quick google scholar search. The opposite is true.

https://dx.doi.org/10.1111/j.1533-8525.2008.01135.x

>The theory of African American alienation is upheld, as African Americans are generally less willing to interracially date than other races and are especially less willing to date European Americans.

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