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Female Chimps Seen Making, Wielding Spears

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Re: Female Chimps Seen Making, Wielding Spears

#21

Post by Crito »

ZanyProgrammer wrote: post #6
Nicholas_C wrote: post #2

Fascinating. I wonder if this was learned through invention or through mimicking humans. If only we could simulate evolution millions of years and see how chimps evolve.

Haven't chimps already been evolving in tandem with our last common ancestor for millions of years? Why should they suddenly fast forward their evolutionary progress now that we are observing them?

This may be what you are driving at, but in case it isn't: The impression that chimps are suddenly rapidly evolving may simply be a consequence of us watching them closely. We may simply be noticing behaviors that have been present for much longer.

Re: Female Chimps Seen Making, Wielding Spears

#22

Post by Nicholas_C »

dghf wrote: post #10
Nicholas_C wrote: post #2

Fascinating. I wonder if this was learned through invention or through mimicking humans. If only we could simulate evolution millions of years and see how chimps evolve.

Wouldn't we have to be the ones in the terrarium? Few years pass for the party zipping round at a large percentage of c , many years pass for those left behind on Earth.

Yup. Got that backwards.

Re: Female Chimps Seen Making, Wielding Spears

#23

Post by thisjepisje »

njharman wrote: post #11
Nicholas_C wrote: post #2

Fascinating. I wonder if this was learned through invention or through mimicking humans. If only we could simulate evolution millions of years and see how chimps evolve.

> If only we could simulate evolution a few million years and see how chimps evolve. Look around. I see no reason a primate so similar to humans would not continue to evolve along the same lines.

Because humans already exist, perhaps.

Re: Female Chimps Seen Making, Wielding Spears

#24

Post by rickdale »

I was watching a show about Orangutans recently and one of the things I thought was interesting was that orangutans in the wild are independent in the sense that they usually eat by themselves. But when they are put in captivity and they are around other orangutans they start to learn from each other and build off of each others concepts. In the wild when alone they stick with what they know, but when around other orangutans they learn from each other.

Chimps on the other hand eat and do other stuff with each other and are usually(if not always) part of a group and so they have more complex actions in nature just from learning from one another, picking up tips and building upon what they know.

Re: Female Chimps Seen Making, Wielding Spears

#25

Post by Dn_Ab »

Someone wrote: post #12
Nicholas_C wrote: post #2

Fascinating. I wonder if this was learned through invention or through mimicking humans. If only we could simulate evolution millions of years and see how chimps evolve.

That idea is over 70 years old.n http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microcosmic_God : "A highly secretive and reclusive biochemist named Kidder produces inventions that transform human life, spanning every aspect of science and engineering. Unbeknownst to anyone, Kidder has developed a synthetic life form, which he calls "neoterics." These creatures live at a greatly accelerated rate, and therefore have a very short life…

Other excellent stories in this genre: Blood Music by Greg Bear, Permutation City and Crystal Nights (http://ttapress.com/553/crystal-nights-by-greg-egan/) by Greg Egan. Marooned in Realtime by Vinge had this a bit too—probably closest thematically to the GP's comment. A bunch of people wake up to a world that's been empty of humans for many thousands of years; the book spends some time talking about how some animals evolved.

Re: Female Chimps Seen Making, Wielding Spears

#26

Post by crimsonalucard »

qiqing wrote: post #7

Excerpt from the article, "The researchers noted that female adult chimps made and used spears more often than adult males. The males relied more on their size and strength for hunting. Female chimps are almost always hindered by infants that ride on their backs or bellies, so spear hunting is far more effective for them than attempting to chase down prey."

This is similar to how human civilization formed. Areas of plentiful food have no need for farming or saving up food as wealth thus, it is only in places where food/resources are less plentiful did technological civilization develop.

Re: Female Chimps Seen Making, Wielding Spears

#27

Post by tomp »

crimsonalucard wrote: post #26
qiqing wrote: post #7

Excerpt from the article, "The researchers noted that female adult chimps made and used spears more often than adult males. The males relied more on their size and strength for hunting. Female chimps are almost always hindered by infants that ride on their backs or bellies, so spear hunting is far more effective for them than attempting to chase down prey."

This is similar to how human civilization formed. Areas of plentiful food have no need for farming or saving up food as wealth thus, it is only in places where food/resources are less plentiful did technological civilization develop.

Also, I've heard the theory (I don't know if it's true) that while Chinese invented porcelain and used it for containers (cups, plates, etc), Europeans never did, and ended up inventing glass instead (and windows, microscopes, telescopes, ...).

Re: Female Chimps Seen Making, Wielding Spears

#28

Post by dools »

crimsonalucard wrote: post #26
qiqing wrote: post #7

Excerpt from the article, "The researchers noted that female adult chimps made and used spears more often than adult males. The males relied more on their size and strength for hunting. Female chimps are almost always hindered by infants that ride on their backs or bellies, so spear hunting is far more effective for them than attempting to chase down prey."

This is similar to how human civilization formed. Areas of plentiful food have no need for farming or saving up food as wealth thus, it is only in places where food/resources are less plentiful did technological civilization develop.

That's inaccurate. You should check out "guns, germs and steel".

Re: Female Chimps Seen Making, Wielding Spears

#29

Post by blawson »

tomp wrote: post #27
crimsonalucard wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is similar to how human civilization formed. Areas of plentiful food have no need for farming or saving up food as wealth thus, it is only in places where food/resources are less plentiful did technological civilization develop.

Also, I've heard the theory (I don't know if it's true) that while Chinese invented porcelain and used it for containers (cups, plates, etc), Europeans never did, and ended up inventing glass instead (and windows, microscopes, telescopes, ...).

They talk about this on the British panel show Qi:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N0OhXxx7cQg&ab_channel=solip...

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