It makes as much sense to ticket pedestrians crossing during the countdown, as it would to ticket drivers for entering the intersection during a yellow light.
California's Broken Jaywalking Law
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Re: California's Broken Jaywalking Law
#62Refuse to talk to cops (always, not just about jaywalking). Do not provide ID ever (unless driving, since it also happens to be your DL) and do not answer questions as to whether you have ID. The amount of paperwork they'll need to fill out in order to arrest you (and thus allow them to search you [the claim will be that the search is for weapons for their safety, but anything they find is free for them to use/look a…
I applaud your courage to stand up to that but I don't know about following the advice after reading "i do often end up in court with cops over a lot of things, this included"... Confused.
I do the same to protest stupid laws.
Re: California's Broken Jaywalking Law
#63Anecdotally (I'm posting this to see if I'm the only one who's noticed), there's something culturally (or legally) unique about jaywalking in California. The ambiguity of countdown timers should have been a problem in every city/state that put them in. But I can't imagine reading this article about anywhere else because everywhere else, everybody jaywalks all the time and the laws are rarely enforced. But relatively…
It's truly amazing how powerfully people can be conditioned by the government and law.
Re: California's Broken Jaywalking Law
#64Earlier quoted context omitted.
What does a median have to do with it? The countdown allows me to choose to cross if there are 20 sec left (enough time for me to get across anything less than an 8-lane highway) or not to cross till the next light if there are only 3 sec left when I reach the curb. With old-school flashing lights all I know is that the light will change soon, but gives me no idea HOW soon. In pedestrian friendly cities generally peo…
But the countdown occurs while the hand for no crossing is showing and that's jaywalking. Unless the point is to say "don't cross, unless you're fast". After the hand goes up, it should be just don't cross. Otherwise people will mostly try to outrun the light, especially in the US as there is little fear of a stopped driver hitting you (vs, say, Latin American countries).
Yes, the flashing hand (countdown or not) has always been a warning that the light's about to change (like a yellow light for cars). Before the countdown clocks, it was meant to say "don't start crossing" but in most cities people didn't interpret it that way and would start crossing if they were fast walkers. Even if they didn't know how much longer it'd be flashing. The countdown clocks add that information so they can make an informed decision.
I agree that LA shouldn't have bothered with the countdowns if they're going to consider starting across the intersection after the countdown has begun to be jaywalking.
Re: California's Broken Jaywalking Law
#65Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Do not provide ID ever (unless driving, since it also happens to be your DL) and do not answer questions as to whether you have ID. Isn't it technically illegal for an adult not to have ID on them?
EDIT: I found better documentation on this. Some US states require ID. > The person approached is not required to identify himself or answer any other questions, and may leave at any time From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stop_and_identify_statutes#Stat... http://www.quora.com/In-the-US-under-what-situations-are-you... --old: Depends. A quick google found this: http://www.flexyourrights.org/faqs/when-can-police-ask-f…
No states require an ID card. Some states require you to provide ID information, and may detain you as long as necessary to determine your identidy. Thus detainment is often used as an unofficial punishment for not providing an ID card.
Re: California's Broken Jaywalking Law
#66Earlier quoted context omitted.
Agreed; this isn't at all ambiguous. If you were allowed to cross, it would be a walk signal with countdown.
Not if you take the walk signal to mean "it's safe to cross right now," which is not the case if you're on the curb and there's one second left. You also clearly haven't spent much time in L.A...many of these signs flash the walk signal for literally 2 or 3 seconds before beginning the 20 second red countdown.
What's wrong with 2-3sec? That's plenty of time to start walking if you are paying attention in traffic.
Re: California's Broken Jaywalking Law
#67What's interesting is that cities have found that countdown timers cause drivers far up the block to race to beat the green light before to turns yellow/red, which then causes collisions with bikers and pedestrians.
Re: California's Broken Jaywalking Law
#68What's interesting is that cities have found that countdown timers cause drivers far up the block to race to beat the green light before to turns yellow/red, which then causes collisions with bikers and pedestrians.
which cities? I haven't seen this behavior around Boston and the drivers are nuts around here.
Re: California's Broken Jaywalking Law
#69Refuse to talk to cops (always, not just about jaywalking). Do not provide ID ever (unless driving, since it also happens to be your DL) and do not answer questions as to whether you have ID. The amount of paperwork they'll need to fill out in order to arrest you (and thus allow them to search you [the claim will be that the search is for weapons for their safety, but anything they find is free for them to use/look a…
WARNING: If you are in IL you a required to state your name, DOB, and home address.
Re: California's Broken Jaywalking Law
#70Refuse to talk to cops (always, not just about jaywalking). Do not provide ID ever (unless driving, since it also happens to be your DL) and do not answer questions as to whether you have ID. The amount of paperwork they'll need to fill out in order to arrest you (and thus allow them to search you [the claim will be that the search is for weapons for their safety, but anything they find is free for them to use/look a…
WARNING: If you are in IL you a required to state your name, DOB, and home address.
Only if cops have reason to believe you have committed or about to commit a crime. They are NOT allowed to lie about this suspicion if you ask them directly!